Do you consider Witcher 3 to be an RPG?

[rusty_shackleford]

Ciri is ******* awful

My will to play the game is nearly completely drained. I tab out every few minutes now. It's been made exhausting by this one dogshit character.

Do Hearts of Stone if you haven't, some of the best content in any gayme

[Oyster Sauce]

Ciri is ******* awful

My will to play the game is nearly completely drained. I tab out every few minutes now. It's been made exhausting by this one dogshit character.

Do Hearts of Stone if you haven't, some of the best content in any gayme

It was fine. I'm wondering if you're mixing it up with Blood and Wine because it didn't add the extra character development system like you said it would.

[rusty_shackleford]

I'm wondering if you're mixing it up with Blood and Wine because it didn't add the extra character development system like you said it would.

I said B&W adds the character stuff

[Oyster Sauce]

Ciri is ******* awful

My will to play the game is nearly completely drained. I tab out every few minutes now. It's been made exhausting by this one dogshit character.

The climax of the third game in a trilogy is a Mary Sue (who has unskippable main quest dialogue about visiting ******* Cyberpunk 2077) who's at least 50x stronger than you and anyone else in the world, declaring "this is my story, not yours". And she's right!



I would use The Witcher 3 as evidence of video games not being art

[WhiteShark]

Since the Action RPG violates this division, it cannot be an RPG proper; hence, it is a hybrid genre. (LARPs are also not RPGs.)

Here's a question I have - in IE games, and their various spiritual successors, an encounter can be trivialized by channeling the **** clicker mentality, allowing you to kite and manipulate enemies if you can achieve a high enough APM.

Does something like that violate the division?

Yes. I assume that's not how the developers intended the game to be played and is therefore an exploit in a game that is otherwise an RPG. If the developers' intention were that you would play Baldur's Gate as though it were StarCraft, it would be a different genre.

[Old One]

I don't understand why it's important at all whether a game is adventure or role-playing. They're just labels.

[orinEsque]

Any game where you are playing a pre-made character with his own story, i don't consider RPG. There isnt enough choices to make it role play. You are just geralt. It is action, adventure sure.

[lucky-SVLLa]

Cyberpunk 2077 and Avowed are even less RPG-focused than The Witcher 3—and not even close.

Well, at least I’d like to think that Cyberpunk 2077 and Avowed can proudly say we’ve bested Bloodlines 2

[Oyster Sauce]

Cyberpunk 2077 and Avowed are even less RPG-focused than The Witcher 3—and not even close.

Well, at least I’d like to think that Cyberpunk 2077 and Avowed can proudly say we’ve bested Bloodlines 2

2077 has more meaningful skill allocation, upgrades, and C&C

[Vergil]

I don't even consider it a game brother

[rusty_shackleford]

Mandatory 'you must explain your reasoning'

They did not in fact explain their reasoning

[rusty_shackleford]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

[DemoGraph]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

I'd say that it would be more of a slasher (fighting, arcade, whatever... action game).
For me RPG is about C&C and ability to change ingame world within its constraints.

[rusty_shackleford]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

Always feel like build diversity in games with only one character feels like poop because you find a bunch of gear you don't care about and won't ever use. It's cool when you can give it to another character tho.

[rusty_shackleford]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

I'd say that it would be more of a slasher (fighting, arcade, whatever... action game).
For me RPG is about C&C and ability to change ingame world within its constraints.

If you were to rank the RPG-ness of games, would you put Witcher 3 above or below Skyrim? Why?

[DemoGraph]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

I'd say that it would be more of a slasher (fighting, arcade, whatever... action game).
For me RPG is about C&C and ability to change ingame world within its constraints.

If you were to rank the RPG-ness of games, would you put Witcher 3 above or below Skyrim? Why?

I haven't played any of them.

I suspect that I would've placed Witcher higher. Because I vaguely remember reading somewhere that there're branching progression paths for your companions and questlines. While in Skyrim you can only kill and/or **** them and, I think, there're only two predefined endings (empire / nord).

Come to think of it, I don't know where I would've placed Morrowind. It has a single ending, but there're multiple paths to it. But you don't really have an agency in changing the world, you just switch rails. And there're basically zero companions (NPCs) you can seriously affect (besides killing them).
It doesn't have enough fiddly bits. So Morrowind is a good roleplaying experience. But a weak game.

[rusty_shackleford]

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

[DemoGraph]

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

This, but unironically.
I've changed my opinion on "what is a RPG" several times. And my latest take is that, say, even core D&D ruleset isn't necessary RPG ruleset. It might become RPG if DM is good, but roleplayness and gameyness aren't there inherently.

[DecadeRiptide]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

I'd say that it would be more of a slasher (fighting, arcade, whatever... action game).
For me RPG is about C&C and ability to change ingame world within its constraints.

If you were to rank the RPG-ness of games, would you put Witcher 3 above or below Skyrim? Why?

Skyrim above.
Has feels more of a dungeony type game with some story. TW3 feels the other way around

[Finarfin]

People think that RPGs must have character customisation, so many were claiming that the Witcher 3 was not one because you are forced to play as Grealt.

In my opinion it doesn't matter. I've always attributed open world games with dragons, vampires, demons, monsters, sword fighting, etc, with "RPG". I think the term is used rather loosely now anyway.

Most of the people who complained about the character customisation were probably ******* who wanted obese women and pink hair.

If TW3 was an RPG, I would have prefered to play as a full Redania supporter rather than Geralt and his ****** friends.

Eww Redania.

[maidenhaver]

Yes. You journey, gain experience, meet a cast of characters and change the world in some minor ways, get (boring) gear, and you can get in over your head and have to retreat. Iirc you can get gated the further in the wilderness you go. Gwent was more fun than the combat, which was nothing like what they had promised, and rpgs should have a mini game to play at bars. I liked it for the grounded setting, but I only played it twice. I played the first one once, and never got around to the second. Without making my own character, or a party of classes, it isn't a crpg.

[rusty_shackleford]

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

Arguably the entire reason JRPG exists as a genre, crude attempts to mimic tabletop RPGs with limited technology were interpreted without the proper context required to understand the intent.

[rusty_shackleford]

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

Arguably the entire reason JRPG exists as a genre, crude attempts to mimic tabletop RPGs with limited technology were interpreted without the proper context required to understand the intent.

This isn't meant to be derogatory towards the Japanese, I think they did a fine job with what they had, but it was obviously removed from the context that it was created in and resulted in an interesting experiment.

So by following this line of thought, we can actually answer the question "What is the opposite of a JRPG?"
System Shock and Thief.

[rusty_shackleford]

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

Arguably the entire reason JRPG exists as a genre, crude attempts to mimic tabletop RPGs with limited technology were interpreted without the proper context required to understand the intent.

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

Arguably the entire reason JRPG exists as a genre, crude attempts to mimic tabletop RPGs with limited technology were interpreted without the proper context required to understand the intent.

This isn't meant to be derogatory towards the Japanese, I think they did a fine job with what they had, but it was obviously removed from the context that it was created in and resulted in an interesting experiment.

So by following this line of thought, we can actually answer the question "What is the opposite of a JRPG?"
System Shock and Thief.

I don't think there's a term for this but I've been referring to it as "RPG design principles". It's a set of assumptions that are applied when creating content such that the game keeps asking: "Given who this character is, what he can do, what limits him, what the game world knows or remembers about him, and what has happened so far, what should be possible here … and what should follow from it?"
Of course, I doubt most designers are aware they are doing this. It's why some designers seem to have that magic touch which creates RPGs, and copies of said games often feel hollow. In one of Tim Cain's videos he states that he creates quest resolutions that weren't expected but maybe someone figured out how to do it anyways so the game should be able to handle it rather than just ignoring it. I think that's a good example of "RPG principles" designer mindset.

This is the DM. You can have a computer interpret the rulebook's mechanics, but all you're creating is a tactical miniatures game. There is no creative problem solving. Refer to this review of WIZARDRY in Space Gamer:

"WIZARDRY is an excellent simulation …of bad D&D. It is practically all hacking and mapping. There is little opportunity for puzzle-solving[problem solving], negotiation, or role-playing."

IS D&D ABOUT PROBLEM SOLVING?
And the answer to that is Yes. This is from Europa #9(1975)

It is my opinion, however, that there is another explanation for the popularity of the game. It is simply that it is a constant challenge. A never-ending exercise in problem solving, with a variable knowns and suddenly-known unknowns.

There is a reason ULTIMA games were so popular. And it's no surprise that Swen Vincke has been inspired heavily by Ultima VII his entire career while creating some of the most widely praised modern RPGs. "DRPG", "ARPG"(Not to be confused with RPGs with Action combat), and so on are their own distinct genres that are descended from Chainmail's distinct lineage inside of D&D rather than D&D. I think a lot of people would be surprised to learn that in D&D as created you were not intended to use miniatures: Swords & Spells was throwing a bone to those that wanted miniature tactical combat.

[The_Mask]

Medallion's humming... that can only mean one thing! It's time to announce The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Songs of the Past!

This brand new expansion for The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt will take you to the Path with Geralt of Rivia once more. It’s being co-developed with
@Fools_Theory
and is coming to PC, Xbox Series X|S, and PlayStation 5 in 2027. Stay tuned for more information in late summer.

With new content coming to the game, we also need to update our system requirements to ensure smooth performance and compatibility going forward. These requirements will become effective starting from the next update.

https://support.cdprojektred.com/en/wit ... -wild-hunt

We originally planned to make this big reveal during our REDstreams tomorrow, but let's say we found something we didn't yet expect on RED Launcher.

[TND]

Do you guys consider Kingdom Come: Deliverance to be an RPG?

[TND]

@The_Mask bloody ***** ******* why is my question funny you are *******

[rusty_shackleford]

Do you guys consider Kingdom Come: Deliverance to be an RPG?

viewtopic.php?t=2815-what-makes-kingdom ... nce-an-rpg

My answer shifted towards yes. KCD quest & world design has a much stronger emphasis on problem-solving than Witcher 3 does — KCD is much more reactive to Henry than Witcher 3 is to Geralt.

[TND]

Do you guys consider Kingdom Come: Deliverance to be an RPG?

viewtopic.php?t=2815-what-makes-kingdom ... nce-an-rpg

My answer shifted towards yes. KCD quest & world design has a much stronger emphasis on problem-solving than Witcher 3 does — KCD is much more reactive to Henry than Witcher 3 is to Geralt.

There's always a failsafe solution in Kingdom Come Deliverance, there was a quest that convinced me it's an actual RPG on my second playthrough.

https://kingdom-come-deliverance.fandom ... Tough_Love

You can talk to Elishka's in-laws and persuade or bribe them to take her in, but if you kill them instead, Henry has a unique line acknowledging they're dead and that she has nowhere to go except with Hermann. It's a little extra detail that most players will probably never hear, but it does show the world actually tracks and reacts to your choices and responds to them even if you veer way off course like I did.

Finding this little detail on my second playthrough is what made KCD one of my favorite games ever.

[enisey]

Would it be less or more of an RPG if there was actual build diversity and you could play Geralt as a signs-only caster, a crossbow-only geralt, etc.,?

I'd say that it would be more of a slasher (fighting, arcade, whatever... action game).
For me RPG is about C&C and ability to change ingame world within its constraints.

If you were to rank the RPG-ness of games, would you put Witcher 3 above or below Skyrim? Why?

Considering you can meaningfully enjoy Skyrim without doing a single main story quest (outside of the introduction, though mods can bypass it), I would put Skyrim above Witcher 3.

I have done many playthroughs of Skyrim and my experience is wildly different each time. I think that kind of open design more closely resembles TTRPGs.

Definitely a lot to be said about how quest design can turn a non-RPG into an RPG

Arguably the entire reason JRPG exists as a genre, crude attempts to mimic tabletop RPGs with limited technology were interpreted without the proper context required to understand the intent.

On the other hand, if you take "role play" literally, playing a role that is defined for you is still playing a role.

Most JRPGs have established characters and linear stories, and I can't imagine calling them not-RPGs. I suppose what defines those as RPGs is a lack of non-RPG mechanics.

I think any game where you control a character in a story could be considered an RPG, as long as other mechanics aren't so prevalent that it would become more suitable to classify them as some other genre (but with "RPG elements").