Chronicling the inability of gamedevs to make video games

[maidenhaver]

https://bethesda.net/en/article/27ls4Z3 ... me-studios

Meet Jae Espinosa, Lead Systems Designer at Bethesda Game Studios.

► open at your own risk

Uh-oh...

Good.

[gerey]

[SoLong]

I think that's industry standard by now? Games of sufficient size need quite some time to get done and Bioware in particular is in a bit of a "restructuring" after tha Anthem fuckup.

Honestly I prefer a proper game instead of another EA cashgrab. DAI has shown that Bioware can still make good games even if some of their idiocy makes me grit my teeth.

[gerey]

Games of sufficient size need quite some time to get done

No, it's just the competency crisis manifesting in games. Devs teams are made up of diversity hires that treat their job as adult daycare, while outsourcing all the actual work to third-world sweatshops.

20 years ago more was done with less, but then again, back then the vast majority of dev teams were made up of heterosexual White men.

Honestly I prefer a proper game instead of another EA cashgrab.

This is a cashgrab, just not a competently executed one.

DAI has shown that Bioware can still make good games

DAI was dogshit.

[SoLong]

No, it's just the competency crisis manifesting in games. Devs teams are made up of diversity hires that treat their job as adult daycare, while outsourcing all the actual work to third-world sweatshops.

20 years ago more was done with less, but then again, back then the vast majority of dev teams were made up of heterosexual White men.

You realize it can be both right? This is not an either/or decision. Also, games 20 years ago had pixels the size of post-it notes. Games taking longer to make when they get more technically demanding and have a larger file size shouldn't be a surprise.

DAI was dogshit.

Suit yourself, I thought it was second best of the four games we got out of the franchise.

[wndrbr]

I thought it was second best of the four games we got out of the franchise.

that's not a particularly high bar

[Atlantico]

Those are obviously also status symbols.

The modern McIntosh one is for sure. LED illuminated turntable and the app on the iPad

It will impress the average normie a lot

I'd pick the vintage Pioneer set any day

[gerey]

Also, games 20 years ago had pixels the size of post-it notes. Games taking longer to make when they get more technically demanding and have a larger file size shouldn't be a surprise.

This is ********. Not only did developers 20 to 30 years ago need to, usually, develop their own proprietary engines, but much of the middleware in use today didn't exist, they had to account for much greater variety of hardware - PS2, XBOX and GameCube were wildly different systems, to say nothing of the jungle that the PC hardware landscape was.

Modern developers use mature engines that are well documented and have many programmers trained in their use, many of the hardware associated headaches have been done away thanks to standardization, they have access to a huge library of middleware and assets that can be easily adapted for their needs.

And yet, despite all this, despite dwarfing old dev teams by orders of magnitude, making use of outsourcing and having generous development times and budgets, they still **** up, and **** up massively.

This is all the end result of allowing subhumans (non-Whites, sexual degenerates, women) into the industry.

Suit yourself, I thought it was second best of the four games we got out of the franchise.

Of which one was a mobile phone game. Like wunderbar said, being better than Dragon Age 2 isn't much of a challenge.

[SoLong]

This is ********. Not only did developers 20 to 30 years ago need to, usually, develop their own proprietary engines, but much of the middleware in use today didn't exist, they had to account for much greater variety of hardware - PS2, XBOX and GameCube were wildly different systems, to say nothing of the jungle that the PC hardware landscape was.

Modern developers use mature engines that are well documented and have many programmers trained in their use, many of the hardware associated headaches have been done away thanks to standardization, they have access to a huge library of middleware and assets that can be easily adapted for their needs.

You realize that 20 to 30 years ago porting a game to everyone console, pc type and microwave oven wasn'tstandard? As for being forced to develop new engines: It's less work than you might think if the specs you're working with are lower. And no, the hardware variety today isn't smaller than in the past. Quite the opposite, you have more platforms to play games on than we used to.

As for mature engines: Getting an engine ready for programming is indeed convenient... if your boss gives you one that's actually fit for purpose. Often a publisher or developer will mandate one single engine they have the license for and then the programmers need to find workarounds to make an engine work for an RPG even though it was designed for an FPS. (DA:I for example was on Frostbite which wasn't a good fit for it but EA insisted they use it.)

Just for comparison: Tiberian Sun was published in 1999 (well within your time frame) and was around 1.5 GB in size. Around 1 GB of that are the movies. The actual programming (I'm ignoring graphics assets for the moment) was around 500 MB.

There is a reason next to no commerical game published today can still be that small. And no, it's not because the Spaghetti code got worse. Outsourcing didn't help (you're right about that part) but publishers aren't willing to double the time games need to be made and sold only to hire cheap foreign labour.

Of which one was a mobile phone game. Like wunderbar said, being better than Dragon Age 2 isn't much of a challenge.

I didn't count the mobile game actually. I counted DA:A since it's a standalone that cost roughly 40 bucks. With the mobile game I guess it would be second best of five. Thanks for reminding me though.

[Rand]

Suit yourself, I thought it was second best of the four games we got out of the franchise.

Four?
What was the fourth?

[Rand]

The actual programming (I'm ignoring graphics assets for the moment) was around 500 MB.

If you take out graphics and sound, even games today are only a few 10s of megabytes, at most.

For example, if you take out all graphics and sound files, literally everything else in Starfield is 103 MB, and a lot of that is middleware bloat.

[J1M]

No, it's just the competency crisis manifesting in games. Devs teams are made up of diversity hires that treat their job as adult daycare, while outsourcing all the actual work to third-world sweatshops.

20 years ago more was done with less, but then again, back then the vast majority of dev teams were made up of heterosexual White men.

You realize it can be both right? This is not an either/or decision. Also, games 20 years ago had pixels the size of post-it notes. Games taking longer to make when they get more technically demanding and have a larger file size shouldn't be a surprise.

DAI was dogshit.

Suit yourself, I thought it was second best of the four games we got out of the franchise.

Visuals haven't improved in 5 years.

[J1M]

This is ********. Not only did developers 20 to 30 years ago need to, usually, develop their own proprietary engines, but much of the middleware in use today didn't exist, they had to account for much greater variety of hardware - PS2, XBOX and GameCube were wildly different systems, to say nothing of the jungle that the PC hardware landscape was.

Modern developers use mature engines that are well documented and have many programmers trained in their use, many of the hardware associated headaches have been done away thanks to standardization, they have access to a huge library of middleware and assets that can be easily adapted for their needs.

You realize that 20 to 30 years ago porting a game to everyone console, pc type and microwave oven wasn'tstandard? As for being forced to develop new engines: It's less work than you might think if the specs you're working with are lower. And no, the hardware variety today isn't smaller than in the past. Quite the opposite, you have more platforms to play games on than we used to.

As for mature engines: Getting an engine ready for programming is indeed convenient... if your boss gives you one that's actually fit for purpose. Often a publisher or developer will mandate one single engine they have the license for and then the programmers need to find workarounds to make an engine work for an RPG even though it was designed for an FPS. (DA:I for example was on Frostbite which wasn't a good fit for it but EA insisted they use it.)

Just for comparison: Tiberian Sun was published in 1999 (well within your time frame) and was around 1.5 GB in size. Around 1 GB of that are the movies. The actual programming (I'm ignoring graphics assets for the moment) was around 500 MB.

There is a reason next to no commerical game published today can still be that small. And no, it's not because the Spaghetti code got worse. Outsourcing didn't help (you're right about that part) but publishers aren't willing to double the time games need to be made and sold only to hire cheap foreign labour.

Of which one was a mobile phone game. Like wunderbar said, being better than Dragon Age 2 isn't much of a challenge.

I didn't count the mobile game actually. I counted DA:A since it's a standalone that cost roughly 40 bucks. With the mobile game I guess it would be second best of five. Thanks for reminding me though.

EA did not insist that they use frostbite for inquisition.

That was an Edmonton decision.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Games today are much more complex than 20 years ago. The reason why Ubisoft is able to push out a game every year (the same game mind you, but at least it ships!) is because they're reusing the same systems and only adding a little at a time, so they don't have anywhere near as much debugging to do than other devs who build from the ground up each time.

[Decline]

This is all the end result of allowing subhumans (non-Whites, sexual degenerates, women) into the industry.

Tbh, non-whites are better than whites now. Demand less and deliver more in less time. More broadly educated as well. I also don't hire degenerates and women.

[Oyster Sauce]

This is all the end result of allowing subhumans (non-Whites, sexual degenerates, women) into the industry.

Tbh, non-whites are better than whites now. Demand less and deliver more in less time. More broadly educated as well. I also don't hire degenerates and women.

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

[Rand]

This is all the end result of allowing subhumans (non-Whites, sexual degenerates, women) into the industry.

Tbh, non-whites are better than whites now. Demand less and deliver more in less time. More broadly educated as well. I also don't hire degenerates and women.

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

Lol, gottem.
You'll be waiting a long time before you ever get an actual, correct answer to that question...

[Decline]

This is all the end result of allowing subhumans (non-Whites, sexual degenerates, women) into the industry.

Tbh, non-whites are better than whites now. Demand less and deliver more in less time. More broadly educated as well. I also don't hire degenerates and women.

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

What are some good games made in the last 20 years?

[Oyster Sauce]

Tbh, non-whites are better than whites now. Demand less and deliver more in less time. More broadly educated as well. I also don't hire degenerates and women.

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

What are some good games made in the last 20 years?

Here's the team who made the game you host a server for in your signature. What are some good games made by brown development teams?

[Sweeper]

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

Underrail.

[Decline]

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

What are some good games made in the last 20 years?

Here's the team who made the game you host a server for in your signature. What are some good games made by brown development teams?

There are currently no good games, therefore there cannot be good brown people games. That is basic logic. Why are there no good games? Because game companies are located in the west and the western zeitgeist is entirely garbage. This is what this entire thread is about.

Saying Valheim is a good game is quite a stretch. The entire field is lousy and Valheim being better than the competition doesn't make it good. Swedes are also notorious for delivering either ****** games or at least games with very debatable design decisions. They're basically the ******* of game development.

I wouldn't rule out good brown people games in the near future though; why? Because brown people now also have gaming industry and their zeitgeist is not entirely garbage (yet?)

Brazil f.e. has considerable industry. There are some studios there with interesting ideas.
Kerbal Space Program is made by brown people, some consider it a good game.

[gerey]

I wouldn't rule out good brown people games in the near future though; why? Because brown people now also have gaming industry and their zeitgeist is not entirely garbage (yet?)

Statistically, they should be able to make a good game, eventually.

Problem is, gaming has been around for close to 50 years now, yet despite swarthoids outnumbering humans almost to 20 to 1 they have yet to actually make anything of worth. All good games have been made either in North America/Europe or Japan (with a smattering of interesting titles from China/Taiwan and South Korea).

I don't count South America because the games there were obviously made by people with high White admixture.

[Decline]

I wouldn't rule out good brown people games in the near future though; why? Because brown people now also have gaming industry and their zeitgeist is not entirely garbage (yet?)

Statistically, they should be able to make a good game, eventually.

Problem is, gaming has been around for close to 50 years now, yet despite swarthoids outnumbering humans almost to 20 to 1 they have yet to actually make anything of worth. All good games have been made either in North America/Europe or Japan (with a smattering of interesting titles from China/Taiwan and South Korea).

I don't count South America because the games there were obviously made by people with high White admixture.

It is a cultural thing. When you have 12-16 hours of sunlight 365 d/y in which you can bang voluptuous women, why waste your time on computer games? Computer games are good for < 8 h sunlight days in frigid regions where the pale-white population is permanently depressed and the women are terrible.

Also mass-entertainment is inherently Jewish.

On a more serious note, LATAM is the first region I think about when I hear brown people and video games, not ******* sub-Saharan Africa.

[gerey]

On a more serious note, LATAM is the first region I think about when I hear brown people and video games, not ******* sub-Saharan Africa.

felipepepe did a few articles on Chinese, Taiwanese and South Korean developers.

They created a lot of apparently good stuff back in the 80s, 90s and early 00s, before f2p online games really took off in the region and ensured the only things coming out of China and South Korea were glorified skinner boxes.

As an example, Prince of Qin (that did get a Western release, albeit with a poor translation) was an attempt by a Chinese developer to make a Chinese Baldur's Gate.

Things have gotten a tad better in recent years, at least in China, but there's still no particular interest from inside or outside the country to introduce the games to a global audience.

An argument could be made that other populations don't create more content because the West has been so dominant in releasing entertainment for the past 100 years, but if that were the case blacks wouldn't be so obsessed with hollow representation and raceswapping characters.

[Decline]

An argument could be made that other populations don't create more content because the West has been so dominant in releasing entertainment for the past 100 years, but if that were the case blacks wouldn't be so obsessed with hollow representation and raceswapping characters.

The west has been dominant in mass-entertainment for the past 100 years. Even the main competitor to Hollywood, the USSR entertainment industry, was minuscule in comparison. Western societies have been running entirely on entertainment for at least after WW2.

Other regions are slowly catching up, but the question remains if their societies even want to be as entertained as westerners. Demand for entertainment is a very western notion to begin with.

[Rand]

https://www.nexusmods.com/starfield/news/14888

TL;DR: Bugthesda doesn't even understand it's own modding filesystem anymore and ****** up the logic that previously worked.

[Rand]

[Segata]

Shadows are now an arcane concept for devs

[J1M]

Shadows are now an arcane concept for devs

I prefer blob shadows over hard edges and lower framerates.

[Breathe]

What are some good games made by brown development teams?

Underrail.

Aren't they Serbian? I had a couple of Serbian teammates in college and they were both very White.