Nonexistent/underrepresented RPG roles

[rusty_shackleford]

I was just making a joke.

But I want it.

[Norfleet]

I was just making a joke. There's a weird tendency for people to nerd out about making the fighter's life harder, but nobody bats an eye at random reagents like guano being available everywhere at affordable prices.

Guano is especially random, since nobody in Europe thought about it to the point where there wasn't even a word for it. So it's interesting that a wizard can go and buy a thing that is not used by anyone to the point where nobody even has a word for it. It does, on the other hand, seem like an appropriate ingredient for a fireball spell. Especially since I can cast fireball IRL with that.

[rusty_shackleford]

I want entire economies underpinned by adventurers getting paid wages to go spelunking in goblin caves to collect bat guano.


It's the sort of thing you see happen organically in MMOs, to some degree.

[Norfleet]

I want entire economies underpinned by adventurers getting paid wages to go spelunking in goblin caves to collect bat guano.

Speedrunning the tech tree all the way to the 1800s, I see. Guano and any potential use for it was so unknown to Europeans that they literally did not have a word for it. It's a Spanish word that was borrowed from the Indians, so it's right up there with the potato, which gives us a funny line I remember from some medieval game, "Potatoes? What are potatoes? Are they edible?". So it actually makes sense that Gollum has no idea what a potato is, since in his time, they didn't exist. Hobbits clearly do not discover potatoes until well after Smeagol's banishment.

[TKVNC]

I want entire economies underpinned by adventurers getting paid wages to go spelunking in goblin caves to collect bat guano.

Speedrunning the tech tree all the way to the 1800s, I see. Guano and any potential use for it was so unknown to Europeans that they literally did not have a word for it. It's a Spanish word that was borrowed from the Indians, so it's right up there with the potato, which gives us a funny line I remember from some medieval game, "Potatoes? What are potatoes? Are they edible?". So it actually makes sense that Gollum has no idea what a potato is, since in his time, they didn't exist. Hobbits clearly do not discover potatoes until well after Smeagol's banishment.

The Guild, I think.

The cart drivers sometimes say "Potatoes? What are potatoes? Can you eat them? I'd like to know as I'm very hungry!"

[Acrux]

I was just making a joke. There's a weird tendency for people to nerd out about making the fighter's life harder, but nobody bats an eye at random reagents like guano being available everywhere at affordable prices.

Guano is especially random, since nobody in Europe thought about it to the point where there wasn't even a word for it. So it's interesting that a wizard can go and buy a thing that is not used by anyone to the point where nobody even has a word for it. It does, on the other hand, seem like an appropriate ingredient for a fireball spell. Especially since I can cast fireball IRL with that.

A lot of spell component in AD&D are jokes.

Fireball - sulphur and guano
Lightning bolt - a piece of fur and a glass rod
Darkvision - carrot
Detect thoughts - a copper piece (aka penny)
Fear - a white feather
Illusion spells requiring fleece
And so on...

[rusty_shackleford]

I was just making a joke. There's a weird tendency for people to nerd out about making the fighter's life harder, but nobody bats an eye at random reagents like guano being available everywhere at affordable prices.

Guano is especially random, since nobody in Europe thought about it to the point where there wasn't even a word for it. So it's interesting that a wizard can go and buy a thing that is not used by anyone to the point where nobody even has a word for it. It does, on the other hand, seem like an appropriate ingredient for a fireball spell. Especially since I can cast fireball IRL with that.

A lot of spell component in AD&D are jokes.

Fireball - sulphur and guano
Lightning bolt - a piece of fur and a glass rod
Darkvision - carrot
Detect thoughts - a copper piece (aka penny)
Fear - a white feather
Illusion spells requiring fleece
And so on...

They shouldn't be

[Acrux]

Guano is especially random, since nobody in Europe thought about it to the point where there wasn't even a word for it. So it's interesting that a wizard can go and buy a thing that is not used by anyone to the point where nobody even has a word for it. It does, on the other hand, seem like an appropriate ingredient for a fireball spell. Especially since I can cast fireball IRL with that.

A lot of spell component in AD&D are jokes.

Fireball - sulphur and guano
Lightning bolt - a piece of fur and a glass rod
Darkvision - carrot
Detect thoughts - a copper piece (aka penny)
Fear - a white feather
Illusion spells requiring fleece
And so on...

They shouldn't be

They first appeared in-game in the AD&D Player's Handbook. I think there was a Dragon article about them before that. I wonder if Gary was using them in his home game at that time.

[Norfleet]

Darkvision - carrot

The funny thing is that the carrot thing is British war propaganda. They didn't want the Germans to know that the real reason they were finding their bombers at night was radar, so they concocted the carrots lie. As it turns out, carrots actually do the opposite and make your night vision worse, because the thing that is in carrots is preferentially used in eyes over the version that actually helps your night vision, resulting in worse night vision. Drink fish oil instead.

[DemoGraph]

Spellbooks getting wet is severely underrepresented in games!

In Magicka you can electrocute yourself, if you're wet. And you get additional damage from lightning.

[Rand]

Combat tactician that directs the other members of combat and everyone begins panicking if he goes down. Could even blow a whistle and have cool hand maneuvers.


Sometimes you see things like a 'leader' that gives small bonuses, but I want to see it turned into a real role. Closest is the one Rogue Trader class. Also, ATOM RPG lets you issue commands to allies on your turn.

4th edition D&D had these.
They had some supernatural ability to heal people at range by ordering them to feel better, like a military faith-healing charlatan instead of the financial con-man or schizophrenic version.

[Tweed]

Guano is especially random, since nobody in Europe thought about it to the point where there wasn't even a word for it. So it's interesting that a wizard can go and buy a thing that is not used by anyone to the point where nobody even has a word for it. It does, on the other hand, seem like an appropriate ingredient for a fireball spell. Especially since I can cast fireball IRL with that.

A lot of spell component in AD&D are jokes.

Fireball - sulphur and guano
Lightning bolt - a piece of fur and a glass rod
Darkvision - carrot
Detect thoughts - a copper piece (aka penny)
Fear - a white feather
Illusion spells requiring fleece
And so on...

They shouldn't be

The cantrip for creating a spark required the caster to rub his thumb across across the top of his index finger while chanting the magic word "zhep-oh."

Time to throw away those dnd books and play a serious game for men, I guess.

[Brother Michael]

A suggestion I like from Bandit's Keep on jewtube regarding how to make wizards fun with very few or specialized spells is that "no one knows what your level is." If a character is a level 2 wizard, all the locals know is that he can cast spells. With time, they will probably realize that he's not much better than a common magician and will cease to fear him. But if you're a regular guard, and the proven wizard who just showed up to town threatens to turn your skin inside out, are you going to call his bluff?

[J1M]

Combat tactician that directs the other members of combat and everyone begins panicking if he goes down. Could even blow a whistle and have cool hand maneuvers.


Sometimes you see things like a 'leader' that gives small bonuses, but I want to see it turned into a real role. Closest is the one Rogue Trader class. Also, ATOM RPG lets you issue commands to allies on your turn.

4th edition D&D had these.
They had some supernatural ability to heal people at range by ordering them to feel better, like a military faith-healing charlatan instead of the financial con-man or schizophrenic version.

Hit points are an abstract concept. They do not represent meat.

[Norfleet]

They had some supernatural ability to heal people at range by ordering them to feel better, like a military faith-healing charlatan instead of the financial con-man or schizophrenic version.

It's a real ability common to sergeants everywhere. ON YOUR FEET, SOLDIER!

[Rand]

Combat tactician that directs the other members of combat and everyone begins panicking if he goes down. Could even blow a whistle and have cool hand maneuvers.


Sometimes you see things like a 'leader' that gives small bonuses, but I want to see it turned into a real role. Closest is the one Rogue Trader class. Also, ATOM RPG lets you issue commands to allies on your turn.

4th edition D&D had these.
They had some supernatural ability to heal people at range by ordering them to feel better, like a military faith-healing charlatan instead of the financial con-man or schizophrenic version.

Hit points are an abstract concept. They do not represent meat.

They do and they don't.
But it's still ******* stupid to let people heal because of encouragement or orders.

[rusty_shackleford]

"hitpoints don't represent life!!!!"

ok so why can vampires drain them and gain HP then

[Rand]

A suggestion I like from Bandit's Keep on jewtube regarding how to make wizards fun with very few or specialized spells is that "no one knows what your level is." If a character is a level 2 wizard, all the locals know is that he can cast spells. With time, they will probably realize that he's not much better than a common magician and will cease to fear him. But if you're a regular guard, and the proven wizard who just showed up to town threatens to turn your skin inside out, are you going to call his bluff?

It depends on the world.
If magicians are common enough, people will have some understanding of what is and isn't reasonable, unless there is a concerted campaign to confuse them. (Which is in the magician's best interests.)
This idea presumes that magicians are very rare.
In most "default" D&D worlds, wizards are almost as common as religious mages, and less than an order of magnitude less common than a talented warrior.
Villagers may rarely see them except when they pass by, but there will be town wizards everywhere, and "guilds" in every city.

[Brother Michael]

A suggestion I like from Bandit's Keep on jewtube regarding how to make wizards fun with very few or specialized spells is that "no one knows what your level is." If a character is a level 2 wizard, all the locals know is that he can cast spells. With time, they will probably realize that he's not much better than a common magician and will cease to fear him. But if you're a regular guard, and the proven wizard who just showed up to town threatens to turn your skin inside out, are you going to call his bluff?

It depends on the world.
If magicians are common enough, people will have some understanding of what is and isn't reasonable, unless there is a concerted campaign to confuse them. (Which is in the magician's best interests.)
This idea presumes that magicians are very rare.
In most "default" D&D worlds, wizards are almost as common as religious mages, and less than an order of magnitude less common than a talented warrior.
Villagers may rarely see them except when they pass by, but there will be town wizards everywhere, and "guilds" in every city.

I’m assuming this is in an actually good fantasy setting, not the default D&D world.

[J1M]

"hitpoints don't represent life!!!!"

ok so why can vampires drain them and gain HP then

Hit points are an abstract concept that represent a bundle of things. A vampire can drain blood, rejuvenating itself represented by HP, and at the same time that player can have its hit points restored via non-magical, non-blood transfusion, means by hearing an Inspiring Word from the Warlord that increases morale.

Also, D&D vampires are weird compared to many other vampires and I don't know if they even drink blood or sip souls or something else.

[rusty_shackleford]

"hitpoints don't represent life!!!!"

ok so why can vampires drain them and gain HP then

Hit points are an abstract concept that represent a bundle of things. A vampire can drain blood, rejuvenating itself represented by HP, and at the same time that player can have its hit points restored via non-magical, non-blood transfusion, means by hearing an Inspiring Word from the Warlord that increases morale.

Also, D&D vampires are weird compared to many other vampires and I don't know if they even drink blood or sip souls or something else.

Hit points are supposed to represent luck, how hard you are to hit, etc., You going down was you actually getting hit by a real blow.
I'd have to pull the books out but I'm almost certain that was how it was explained originally anyways.

[J1M]

"hitpoints don't represent life!!!!"

ok so why can vampires drain them and gain HP then

Hit points are an abstract concept that represent a bundle of things. A vampire can drain blood, rejuvenating itself represented by HP, and at the same time that player can have its hit points restored via non-magical, non-blood transfusion, means by hearing an Inspiring Word from the Warlord that increases morale.

Also, D&D vampires are weird compared to many other vampires and I don't know if they even drink blood or sip souls or something else.

Hit points are supposed to represent luck, how hard you are to hit, etc., You going down was you actually getting hit by a real blow.
I'd have to pull the books out but I'm almost certain that was how it was explained originally anyways.

Generally agree, but hit points is not directly equal to dodge AC. Perhaps it is most succinctly explained as operating the way movie logic does for characters getting hurt. A measure of how close you are to being unable to fight rather than a direct accounting of cuts and bruises.

[DemoGraph]

Hit points are an abstract concept that represent a bundle of things. A vampire can drain blood, rejuvenating itself represented by HP, and at the same time that player can have its hit points restored via non-magical, non-blood transfusion, means by hearing an Inspiring Word from the Warlord that increases morale.

Also, D&D vampires are weird compared to many other vampires and I don't know if they even drink blood or sip souls or something else.

Hit points are supposed to represent luck, how hard you are to hit, etc., You going down was you actually getting hit by a real blow.
I'd have to pull the books out but I'm almost certain that was how it was explained originally anyways.

Generally agree, but hit points is not directly equal to dodge AC. Perhaps it is most succinctly explained as operating the way movie logic does for characters getting hurt. A measure of how close you are to being unable to fight rather than a direct accounting of cuts and bruises.

It's exactly why there's a 1st level Cleric spell to restore 1d8+lvl HP called CURE LIGHT LUCKS NOT BRUISES.

[J1M]

Hit points are supposed to represent luck, how hard you are to hit, etc., You going down was you actually getting hit by a real blow.
I'd have to pull the books out but I'm almost certain that was how it was explained originally anyways.

Generally agree, but hit points is not directly equal to dodge AC. Perhaps it is most succinctly explained as operating the way movie logic does for characters getting hurt. A measure of how close you are to being unable to fight rather than a direct accounting of cuts and bruises.

It's exactly why there's a 1st level Cleric spell to restore 1d8+lvl HP called CURE LIGHT LUCKS NOT BRUISES.

Not sure why this is so hard to understand. That is one element that the abstract concept of hit points covers and the one divine magic interacts with the most.

Bards have a level 1 ability that is mechanically equivalent called Majestic Word:
"You utter words laden with preternatural inspiration, restoring your ally's stamina and making wounds seem insignificant."

[rusty_shackleford]

Vampires to be renamed to stampires

[DemoGraph]

Not sure why this is so hard to understand.

Not sure why it's that hard to understand that Cure Light/Moderate/Serious Wounds potion was actually called "**** you, lady luck", but it was lost in translation.
She's a *****, after all, she gives out those luck points only when you rest and recuperate and gives out more when your rest is uninterrupted.

Once I fell to zero luck points. I was in hospital, resting and recuperating, and wanted to play snakes and ladders with my bud. Alas, since I was at 0 luck points, every time I rolled the die, it turned out 1. Truly infuriating! So from that day I try to sleep really well before every visit to casino. Those slot machines are absolute suckers of luck points. Once I've pushed that lever one time too many and fell unconscious! Can you believe it?!

So I've decided to drop gambling and enlist into military. Paladinship is my new cause! I really like to lay hands on my party members to restore their luck and inspiration (especially on elven ladies). Alas, more often than not, I have to use my hands to destroy luck of those pesky undeads. Lucky buggers! I'm so tired of poking them with pitchforks until they run out of luck! To be honest, I envy @ERYFKRAD a bit. His +3 STR and great axe just tear that luck apart! I wonder whether he is good at slot machines...

[Stack of Turtles]

Hit points have always been intended to be the character's supple yielding flesh and absolutely do not represent "luck", but they're also abstract and nonlinear so characters aren't supposed to be trading axe blows to the face without obvious harm either.

[rusty_shackleford]

Hit points have always been intended to be the character's supple yielding flesh and absolutely do not represent "luck", but they're also abstract and nonlinear so characters aren't supposed to be trading axe blows to the face without obvious harm either.

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Selection_002.webp

[rusty_shackleford]

luckpire

[Stack of Turtles]

Hit points have always been intended to be the character's supple yielding flesh and absolutely do not represent "luck", but they're also abstract and nonlinear so characters aren't supposed to be trading axe blows to the face without obvious harm either.

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I see, this definitely proves that you found an image of some text that says it, for sure.