November: Ambermoon

[rusty_shackleford]

Alright, let's goooo



Oh...

You speak germoid... Updated my journal

[DagothGeas5]

Wanted to start this one in the future, but wanted to ask. I fired it up to see if it works but during the intro sequence it says "20 years after the events of Amberstar", and looking up the game on Wikipedia said that this game is a sequel to it. I have not seen Amberstar being mentioned anywhere that I could find in this topic, nor does it seem to have an entry with the Adventurer's Guild that I could find, so, while I will still play Amberstar first before this one, I wanted to ask about this. Is it an unrelated sequel in some way and just set in the same universe?

[Acrux]

Amberstar is the first. We started with Ambermoon because of the Ambermoon Advenced project that makes it easy to install on modern OS.

[1998]

It's also very easy to get into. It almost feels like one of those modern retro-games. I am not sure what was added/modified for the Advanced projects, but UI/controls are really very good considering its age.

[Tangerine]

Wanted to start this one in the future, but wanted to ask. I fired it up to see if it works but during the intro sequence it says "20 years after the events of Amberstar", and looking up the game on Wikipedia said that this game is a sequel to it. I have not seen Amberstar being mentioned anywhere that I could find in this topic, nor does it seem to have an entry with the Adventurer's Guild that I could find, so, while I will still play Amberstar first before this one, I wanted to ask about this. Is it an unrelated sequel in some way and just set in the same universe?

It's a related sequel, but the events of the previous game happened decades before. I hadn't played Amberstar, so I missed references that were made to it, but the narrative of Ambermoon was understandable without having played the prior game.

[rusty_shackleford]

If you liked it I'd suggest giving Albion a go, it's the last game made by the same guys in a similar style. I was surprised at how 'advanced' it felt for the time it was made, it almost felt like a game that was influenced by Fallout despite predating it.

[1998]

First island done. That took quite a bit. Exploration great, combat not so much. If it would be at least fast, but some encounters take ages, especially very early on.

[1998]

Finished.

Started off strong but went downhill fast. Really a slog to get through it in the end.

[J1M]

I can see someone who only gets a game or two a year for their Amiga being very happy to receive Ambermoon for Christmas. The game is so vast it would last someone all the way to summer holidays. It's a good example of when content took less time to create (2D map editor, add a switch and an illusionary wall) than it took to play. With high-res graphics and voice acting and such, that equation has obviously been flipped for a while and games have been more about 'watching' than 'exploring'.

That said, this game has quite possibly the worst tutorial ever. The game sends you into a cellar with a few enemies and then puts you up against a POISON SPIDER. There's nothing really in the way of tactics here. You swing your only attack with a 40% chance to hit and drink a potion when you drop to 5 of 10 hit points. To grind up or train to do better, you'd have to know to ignore your dying grandfather's wishes, walk 10 miles to town, and hang out in dark alleys until someone attacks you. Maybe I just had bad luck with my combat rolls, but I died to the poison spider half a dozen times. Checked the walkthrough to make sure I wasn't missing anything. I wasn't. I really don't understand how this game can have been patched for decades and remade while leaving that intact. Similarly, the start of the game feels very slow and distracted because the first place you visit is a major town. I would have preferred a small outpost with only a couple of buildings before being sent to the first proper maze or whatever. Maybe it's just me, but I don't care to talk to NPCs, especially before the game has established itself as something I care about.

The world felt big, but the fog of darkness was so oppressive it made me not want to explore. The quick travel options in the cities were nice. I like the game's title. Does a good job of implying people who liked Amberstar would want to check out Ambermoon, without making people feel like they have to play the first one. Which is the most common question when I recommend something like Lufia 2. The other biomes you visit were refreshing. Would have liked to see them earlier in the game for variety. Was also interesting that wandering monsters don't exist until you visit those places. I liked that you could substitute lock picks for a thief party member and a **** for the levitate spell. Seemed like an appropriate tradeoff given how tight the carrying weight was balanced. Didn't enjoy the 3D exploration camera moving vertically based on which character was selected.

But let's talk about the biggest issue. Did every medieval fantasy game of this era give you a spaceship at the end? Or is that just a criteria for AG Classic? I find it extremely jarring. Would much rather see something like a teleporter in a ritual circle if we have to travel to the moon.





@Oyster Sauce

[rusty_shackleford]

But let's talk about the biggest issue. Did every medieval fantasy game of this era give you a spaceship at the end? Or is that just a criteria for AG Classic? I find it extremely jarring. Would much rather see something like a teleporter in a ritual circle if we have to travel to the moon.

Sci-fi and fantasy used to be mixed all the time, there was much less of a border separating them until more recently. Ambermoon was probably on the tail end of this, tho.
A lot of old D&D modules do it, however.
I think Temple of the Frog is probably the oldest example, but Blackmoor is full of sci-fi stuff

Comes up a lot in Judges Guild material too
[edit]
Judges Guild sci-fi stuff:

Like Arcanum for instance that stated how "magic" was twisting the laws of physics while "technology" was working in tandem with said laws, but even that didn't made much sense to me because if there is indeed some force can twist the laws of physics, then why would this force be incompatible with anything that woks in tandem with laws that this force can twist?

Arcanum implies that in the past magic and technology DID work in tandem. You can find schematics for "lost" technology like a magical gun. The setting is at the beginning of their Industrial Revolution where the scientific consensus at that time is that they are incompatible because most technological knowledge was lost in a worldwide catastrophe. And I think Tim Cain has said that the sequel would have explored more about how the two interact when working together.

This is actually found in the primary Judges guild product too. I'm unsure if it was the Judges guild writer that included it, or perhaps they were influenced from Judges guild material consciously or subconsciously.
Too lazy to go dig thru all their material so here's a copy-pasted list from elsewhere of lost technology in Judges guild material:

Judges Guild's campaign world (City State of the Invincible Overlord, City State of the World Emperor, etc.) is a standard fantasy setting with spells, magic items and medieval level technology. However, some supplements have examples of high tech relics from the past.

• Revised Guide to the City State (of the Invincible Overlord). The Hell-Bridge Temple treasury holds two walkie-talkies, each charged for 10 uses.
• The Fantastic Wilderlands Beyonde
  • Sea of Five Winds hex 0307. An audio system that can perform recording and PA (Public Address) functions.
  • Sea of Five Winds hex 1828. A usable periscope lies under a table in a partially burnt cottage.
  • Elephant Lands Ruins & Relics hex 2223. Three orcs are playing with a periscope.
  • Elephant Lands Ruins & Relics. Hex 4207 has a partially operational tape recorder.
  • Lenap Idyllic Isles hex 2107. A corroded battery can be found in a leather pouch.
  • Lenap Idyllic Isles hex 2410. A "dangerously operational" steam locomotive is in a crumbled temple.
  • Lenap Idyllic Isles hex 3432. An airplane propeller is used as a ship's anchor.
  • Lenap Idyllic Isles hex 4912. Beneath a tower are six deep-sea diving suits and twelve oxygen tanks.
  • Lenap Idyllic Isles hex 5016. A ruined aerial balloon holds a telescope.
• Wilderlands of High Fantasy issues N and O
  • Issue N has a set of tables which include a plethora of relic high tech items with little description. They include a parachute, hang glider, airplanes (prop-driven and jet), a helicopter, a re-entry capsule, a "spacecraft", an anti-grav vehicle, a fully operational "flyer harness" (Jet Pack?), an "underwater suit" (diving suit?), mechanical Powered Armor, vehicles that can bore through earth and rock, and a nuclear submarine.
  • Issue O has a wrecked, yet fully operational hang glider, a partially sunken telescope, a partially operational hot-air balloon and an aqueduct made of steel-reinforced concrete.
• Wilderlands of the Magic Realm
  • Isle of the Blest hex 0513. A mechanical man walks in a circle on the ocean bottom. Its internal mechanisms can't be repaired.
  • Isle of the Blest hex 4131. In the broken hulk of a ship can be found a functioning optical rangefinder.
  • Isle of the Blest hex 4226. A defective crawler/tractor digging machine, deep within an ancient silver mine.
  • Isle of the Blest hex 4429. Ten rolls of stainless steel barbed wire.
  • Before Island has a hidden laboratory complex that contains android parts and other mechanical devices.
  • The Isle of the Giant Sundial has a time machine in the form of a giant sundial.
  • Ebony Coast — Ruins and Relics. In hex 4523, a hill giant uses the stainless steel rudder of an ancient ship as a gardening tool.
  • Idyllic Isles of the Ebony Coast hex 4506. A high tech artifact powered by geothermal energy projects a laser hologram of an elven princess.
  • Ghinor Islands hex 3102. On the island of Skymetal Rock is a building framework made of steel girders.
  • Ghinor - Ruins and Relics. In hex 3406 is an underwater laboratory, the lair of a Mad Scientist looking for experimental subjects.
  • Ament Tundra — Ruins and Relics. A fully operational hang glider is tied down to a small hill in hex 4423.
• Wilderlands of the Fantastic Reaches
  • Idyllic Isles - Ruins and Relics. In hex 2049, a halfling has a x4 power telescope.
  • Silver Skein Isles — Ruins and Relics. In hex 3530 is an ancient machine that travels in a two-mile diameter circle in the ocean. It is a 40 foot long, cigar-shaped object made of seamless metal (possibly a submarine).
• Glory Hole Dwarven Mine. The Dragon King named Kukalkin lived during a period of advanced technology in the planet's history. A number of high tech artifacts were buried with him, including flashlights and batteries, cameras and film, video and computer games, disposable lighters, electric typewriters, hand calculators, wrist radios, telephones, automatic pistols, motorcycles, Geiger counters, television sets, record players and toaster ovens. In one room of the Mine can be found items made of a super durable, super hard plastic.
• Shield Maidens of Sea Rune. The ancient (7,000 years ago) Markab civilization had 1990s equivalent technology, including rifled gunpowder firearms. Their aircraft were capable of powered flight and had VTOL (vertical take-off and landing) capability. Their civilization was destroyed during the Uttermost War (a nuclear war).

[J1M]

That makes sense. I think it would be less jarring if the bits of technology around were not first introduced by a functional space ship. Start with a laser gun or a train.