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The truth of making an ambitious game.

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The truth of making an ambitious game.

Post by NMNFND »

Mental Illness.

Just what is it like to work on one project for years? Well you can expect the following if you are a solo-dev with no resources to contract out anything or buy better tools.
You will die 1000 times and still be working on a project that hasn't released. You will come close to snapping and ending up in prison almost as many times as you
die from waking up realizing you may never finish your game or get it out there. Everyone will take advantage of you because they realize they know where you are and
what you're doing. People realize that you aren't doing anything but an activity. They don't ever grow distant, they grow aggressive and stomp on you like you don't exist,
and milk you like you do exist when it suits their agenda. You don't need to reveal you're working on a game or any details, to be trolled utterly by other humans who can see
you have something important to you.

Activists and the world in general will continue on a downslide toward your worst fears. In fact it gets exponentially worse. The socioeconomics and the agendas of activists utterly trash your own origins from ever being possible again. This adds to the stress and makes you less relevant as a human being because they redefine the landscape of social values and what
matters. All you you have is a game and you are going to be too buck broken to even respond in kind with something edgy that could turnback the clock on the society that failed
while you were busy developing a game.

You won't be able to quit even when you are resting. Rest is so you have enough energy to wakeup and be miserable again.
You will be a zombie except you are being tortured everyday. You are losing opportunities and the ability to be successful in other areas of life.
I'ts not just other skills you miss out on, it's all the stuff you should be doing if you don't want to end up without a network.

You must remain absolutely focused and aren't allowed to burn out. As you are weakened by the non-stop drive to work on a project
much bigger than a week, a month, or a year, you will become fragile. Anything, almost anything could destroy your dream.

Working on a game alone, especially if it's your first game and one you need to succeed... It's very much like surviving without
any survival skills. And doesn't get easier. The project is so massive and so unending in its demand, you never start with an advantage.

Because despite the truth of progress on X, there's always Y that's next. And it's rarely going to be easy to do.
So also get use to cutting things anyway. Even by cutting things you'll discover your schedule is just as full.

Imagine your mouth is totally filled with steel nails so full you can't even properly close to chew the nails.
Instead you try as hard as you can to push them together to somehow wear them down but it's like trying to crush
steel itself. Each nail needing its care and sharp at one end. Now do this for weeks and months, maybe a year
depending on how efficient you are. At no point do you few accomplished because it's still the same number of nails
never reducing in size, always excuriating. This is what it is like to make a large ambitious game.
And what it's like to make a small game? is just putting some tough to chew jerky or walnuts or some ********.

The effort and hopelessness is literal even if the imagery is not.

Game development causes mental illness that makes things even harder as you go on.
You're not sure who you can trust and you can never have a moment where you aren't thinking about your game.
You think so often and so fast about your game's future you driven to cringe almost instantly.
You canibalize most of your energy and time just thinking about your game. Because it's the only thing that if you keep thinking about it,
you can remain entertained and not distracted.

Game development is boring. It also is extremely difficult. The fraction of time it is enjoyable is very very very small.

Game development is self-sacrifice on a world-class scale. It also doesn't ******* pay if you are a solo-dev.
Your everything will be out of date by the time you release and someone will have done better in most categories
that exist. You will be replaced by technology and annihilated by the poor timing of release.
Your game will be buried forever or it will be held up high.

It's true that some game developers make it seem very fun. Afterall they made the fun game and they are highly experience
and take roles they usually know how to do. But the truth is gamedeveloment is not fun.
It's not a diverse process of make fun thing, test fun thing, come up with fun solution, take a break to think about other fun things,
return back to have more fun. It's utter hell.

GameDev can only be fun if you have equivalent of rpgmaker with no expectation of writing extensions.
In other words GameDev begins when your tools are ******* done. And that means you have many failed products precisley because the tooling
wasn't good enough to accomplish iteration and fleshing out.

GameDev is full of uncertainty. You're not going to be able to fix every problem you have unless your game was utterly simple to begin with.
For solo-devs the truth is you don't have time or resources to solve all the specialist issues.

Nothing about the GameDev pipeline is fun. Unless everything is already done. But if your game is original you bettter ******* hope it's for
tools you really can master quickly and aren't going to change.

What is 4 years? What is 2 years? What is 1 year? What is 2 months ? What is 1 month?
The answers might seem manageable but the reality is far from so simple.

It's not a bunch of days of average or exceptional success. It's tons of horrific failure constantly plaguing you
making day 100 look like day 10. Day 300 look like day 30.

This isn't just about being OCD or having some 'tism about things being wrong.

It's as if most people think gamedev is just another hobby. I promise you it's not unless you insist on treating it that way.
Thinking real gamedev is a hobby is like thinking gluing sticks together in arts and craft makes you a hardened navy seal.

All your dreams will be crushed, all your nightmares will become true, and so many more horrors are in store for you,
that would never ever have started if you knew. But you must keep fighting on, dying, realizing almost any other path in life was a better choice
for happiness and a sense of real success. And you're only real in when you can never turn back, you can only fail, and failure is one issue you can't quite fix away.

You will develop many mental illnesses. Warping of your mind trying to keep up with the demand of a project that won't end for years.
You will not have worthwhile screenshots or a solid moment to advertise ****.

Take it from me no one gives a **** about your game or even they **** they claim to care about.
People are convinced they can just buy up packs of games on steam and maybe will themselves to play those.
They will never your ******** demo.


But perhaps you know how to peacock very well. But ask yourself, can you really make the game worth losing months of your life on without
these demo players? Because if you can't, you will not survive.


I'd advise no one without a substantial savings account, and a deathwish, to even bother making an ambitious game.
I dont' care if you have 20 years of experience. It isn't enough.

But is it enough to be proud of your own accomplishment despite all this? No. The fact is if you made something worth making,
you'll also be sleeping on 1000 crashed rockets shrapnel/debris and dumpster diving for hallucinations of replacements to things you can never replace.
DuckTape is your god and you are broken until your game is done. Wait till you see how people wipe their *** with new games.

Go on go watch those sweet little videos making game dev look simple and easy and manageable. It's not.
Your existence, and the existence of your world will be worth less than your game. They will be of extreme negative value compared to your ambitious game that will seem rather average to most.
You still won't be able to appreciate your own accomplishments regardless. Unless you cuckout and giveup. Then you could maybe enjoy some piece of accomplishment.
But the first weirdo who focuses on a tiny thing a bit better than you did, will steal your thunder in a matter of days or weeks. Because no one truly understands
the affect of size and quantity.

They just think quality is all that exists in the end. Git Gud or Git Lost.
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Post by Tweed »

Did anyone actually read all of that?
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Post by rusty_shackleford »

Tweed wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 10:10
Did anyone actually read all of that?
The text describes the challenges of being a solo game developer, who lacks resources and support to create a game. The author highlights that it can be a lonely, frustrating and mentally challenging experience to work on a game for years without any guarantee of success. The pressure to create something original and innovative, combined with the difficulty of finding the right tools and solving technical issues, can lead to burnout and mental illness. The author concludes that game development can be rewarding, but only if the right tools are available, and the challenges of solo development are overcome.
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Post by Tweed »

So the first two words could have sufficed for the entire argument.
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Post by Segata »

rusty_shackleford wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 10:15
Tweed wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 10:10
Did anyone actually read all of that?
The text describes the challenges of being a solo game developer, who lacks resources and support to create a game. The author highlights that it can be a lonely, frustrating and mentally challenging experience to work on a game for years without any guarantee of success. The pressure to create something original and innovative, combined with the difficulty of finding the right tools and solving technical issues, can lead to burnout and mental illness. The author concludes that game development can be rewarding, but only if the right tools are available, and the challenges of solo development are overcome.
Sup ChatGPT
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Post by rusty_shackleford »

Segata Sanshiro wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 12:35
rusty_shackleford wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 10:15
Tweed wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 10:10
Did anyone actually read all of that?
The text describes the challenges of being a solo game developer, who lacks resources and support to create a game. The author highlights that it can be a lonely, frustrating and mentally challenging experience to work on a game for years without any guarantee of success. The pressure to create something original and innovative, combined with the difficulty of finding the right tools and solving technical issues, can lead to burnout and mental illness. The author concludes that game development can be rewarding, but only if the right tools are available, and the challenges of solo development are overcome.
Sup ChatGPT
proofs?
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Post by Acrux »

See the words "mental illness", notice a wall of text, immediately close the browser tab.
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Post by Sweeper »

NMNFND wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 08:53
Just what is it like to work on one project for years? Well you can expect the following if you are a solo-dev with no resources to contract out anything or buy better tools.
You will die 1000 times and still be working on a project that hasn't released.
Underrail.
But here's the rub, you gotta be a smart ************.
Although, I guess Styg is a midwit, what with the PSI nerf an' all.
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Post by KnightoftheWind »

My man writing a Lord of the Rings novel over here.
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Post by NotAI »

Tweed wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 10:10
Did anyone actually read all of that?
Yes. "AAA skill: Fast Reading, Lvl. 5"

So my take on it: AI will come to the rescue and save indie developers from their plight!

It'll happen when 3D models can be generated. Soon, in other words, though still will always be an enormous amount of work. The scale and expectations will grow as tools are improved.
Last edited by NotAI on April 29th, 2023, 13:23, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by The_Mask »

Sweeper wrote: ↑ April 28th, 2023, 15:11
the PSI nerf an' all
I actually haven't updated my Underrail since.
Just like Yves, I chase tales
rusty_shackleford wrote: ↑ October 28th, 2024, 07:36
Mediocre or bad games can still have parts that are good.
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Post by Sweeper »

The_Mask wrote: ↑ May 1st, 2023, 20:38
I actually haven't updated my Underrail since.
BASED!
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Post by rusty_shackleford »

Underrail dev: "hmmm today I will arbitrarily re-balance my game for no reason"
ATOM dev: "hmmm today I will add a free major expansion to my game with dozens of quests and hours of content"
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Post by Tweed »

It's not arbitrary. Styg hates trappers, shotguns, and psionics.
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Post by Acrux »

It's good to show contempt for your players.
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Post by rusty_shackleford »

Majority of the players are using an assault rifle build with heavy armor. Don't think that has ever received a single nerf.
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Post by Sweeper »

rusty_shackleford wrote: ↑ May 1st, 2023, 23:05
Don't think that has ever received a single nerf.
Underrail 1.0.4
Release Date: 20 December 2018 (experimental branch) GOG version: None Summary: New foods, mechanics/tweaks/UI/engine changes
Mechanics
Special attack damage bonus no longer works with "unconditional" special attacks, which are special attacks that do not have a cooldown or require special conditions to trigger. So far these are: burst, shotgun burst, heavy punch, and double shot
I can still manage to find the will to play pure PSI after the nerf, ARs without smart modules however are completely dead to me.
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Post by Lhynn »

Underrail has been **** since like 2 months after release. Styg keeps ruining his game and it is incredible to watch.
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Post by KnightoftheWind »

Modern gamers are very low IQ and with even lower attention spans. That's why most games are disposable and just regurgitate old ideas. Sure someone out there could make the next Arx Fatalis or a niche dungeon crawler or anything of the sort, but you're lucky if it'll sell 1000 copies. There are now more games than ever before, thousands upon thousands. And they're not just competing amongst themselves, their competing with games going back 30 years that you can download for free right now.

Why should I play Soyboy Sam's RPG about depression inspired by Earthbound, when I can just play Earthbound?. Why play yet another Metroidvania when I can just play Metroid and Castlevania?. The well of ideas is exhausted, and all we're doing is ripping off the originals but worse.
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Post by WhiteShark »

KnightoftheWind wrote: ↑ May 6th, 2023, 17:34
Modern gamers are very low IQ and with even lower attention spans. That's why most games are disposable and just regurgitate old ideas.
I think this is exaggerated. The average consumer probably is stupider than he once was, but AAA often aims a bit too low. There have been lots of modern titles that assume reasonable intelligence of the player that have done well. The part about a huge library of competition is true, though.
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Post by KnightoftheWind »

WhiteShark wrote: ↑ May 6th, 2023, 18:09
KnightoftheWind wrote: ↑ May 6th, 2023, 17:34
Modern gamers are very low IQ and with even lower attention spans. That's why most games are disposable and just regurgitate old ideas.
I think this is exaggerated. The average consumer probably is stupider than he once was, but AAA often aims a bit too low. There have been lots of modern titles that assume reasonable intelligence of the player that have done well. The part about a huge library of competition is true, though.
Not true, consumers are stupid. Very stupid. The masses have always been NPCs, that's why the very concept of "democracy" and liberalism is flawed and never works. It assumes that the people who vote are 130 IQ landowners with large families who are well learned, and aren't ******* that just want "their team" to win or just want free stuff. Most media is made for the bulk of people, who are absolute peons.

I look on Youtube, I look on gaming forums, I look at chatrooms, and all I see are individuals easily impressed by the most inane tripe. The recent RE4 Remake is being heralded as one of the greatest games of all time, despite being no different to any other third-person shooter. It also comes with Denuvo DRM, tons of microtransactions, and a deluxe edition that costs extra for very little added content. A similar situation is true for Nintendo and Sony titles. Their quality output has declined while their business practices get more brazen, and instead of pushing back the peon masses continue to congregate and spend more money for less quality. The corporations know their audience, so why bother trying?. Just keep the assembly line running with more content to consoom.
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Post by Tweed »

If achievements are to be believed not even a quarter of the players finish the games they play.
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Post by Klerik »

Challenges of making a videogame.


Dealing with ******* gamers.
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Post by WhiteShark »

KnightoftheWind wrote: ↑ May 6th, 2023, 18:38
Not true, consumers are stupid. Very stupid. The masses have always been NPCs, that's why the very concept of "democracy" and liberalism is flawed and never works. It assumes that the people who vote are 130 IQ landowners with large families who are well learned, and aren't ******* that just want "their team" to win or just want free stuff. Most media is made for the bulk of people, who are absolute peons.

I look on Youtube, I look on gaming forums, I look at chatrooms, and all I see are individuals easily impressed by the most inane tripe. The recent RE4 Remake is being heralded as one of the greatest games of all time, despite being no different to any other third-person shooter. It also comes with Denuvo DRM, tons of microtransactions, and a deluxe edition that costs extra for very little added content. A similar situation is true for Nintendo and Sony titles. Their quality output has declined while their business practices get more brazen, and instead of pushing back the peon masses continue to congregate and spend more money for less quality. The corporations know their audience, so why bother trying?. Just keep the assembly line running with more content to consoom.
Yes, I essentially agree with all of this, except that I contend that consumers have a wider hit zone than you're asserting. Yes, suits can largely get away with producing bottom of the barrel trash, but that doesn't mean anything more intellectual than that will be a failure. It is possible to make games of reasonable quality that also have mass appeal; suits just don't because it's harder and they assume that a game that asks anything of the player's capabilities will be too much despite the immense popularity of games like Dark Souls.