******** **** BG3 Did To the Lore

[Shillitron]

Preamble
**** you - I'm making a thread.

Let's keep the Californication / Libural Propaganda **** to a minimum. (If you have a particularly aggrivating example - post it, I just don't want 10 pages of bitching about Minthara's penis bulge... AGAIN)
It's low hanging fruit that we've already bitched about ad-nauseum.


Exhibit A - Balthazar

What the **** did they do to him?
Not to endorse Gaider's ****** writing but let's take this character as his canon representation.

Baldur's Gate 2

- A stoic monk who wants to eliminate all Bhaalspawn to prevent Bhaal / Lord of Murder from ascending.
- He's calm, collected, regiment, independent.
- He's confident and determined in his goals, a leader of a city and has a planned outcome. Playing a slow game.
- Physically strong, Slender build. Bald. White.






Baldur's Gate 3

- Fat Disgusting NEET *** Zombie
- Basically Kethracs little ***** - does whatever he says unquestionably (Has a bunch of diary novels in his library where he constantly talks about how he can better serve his precious kethy-wethy)
- Necromancer now....? Not a Monk anymore?
- Utterly ******** - can't solve a few basic puzzles in Shars ****** temple.. retardedly easy to trick, completely one-dimensional goals.
- Degenerate, Co-dependent, weak willed, etc etc





Conclusion

The writer wanted to do a "MEMBER THIS GUY?" insert but didn't even play the original BG games.

[fkirenicus]

I think that if you follow the correct dialog options, there is an explanation (however feeble it is). This isn't the old B-guy the new B-guy took the old one's name ...and bones, apparently.

[Oyster Sauce]

He stole his corpse.

[Shillitron]

I think that if you follow the correct dialog options, there is an explanation (however feeble it is). This isn't the old B-guy the new B-guy took the old one's name ...and bones, apparently.

Oh really? Lmfao

[rusty_shackleford]

Sarevok

[Anon]

I think that if you follow the correct dialog options, there is an explanation (however feeble it is). This isn't the old B-guy the new B-guy took the old one's name ...and bones, apparently.

Exactly this. Balthazar is a fraud, that's why he's so different. That actually makes him a pretty good character in my eyes.

Nothing is more atrocious than the way they treated Sarevok and Viconia. Sarevok was somebody always guided by self-interest, with Bhaal worship only being a ruse for him to achieve his own interests, and then BG3 depicted him as a Bhaal fanatic.

Same for Viconia, in BG2 she had a "redemption arc" and became a true neutral character. In BG3 she's once again a Shar fanatic for some stupid reason.

Though from what I've read it's mostly WOTC's fault, not Larian. Though Larian could always have simply not used them if they were aware of the way they were treated.

[rusty_shackleford]

I think that if you follow the correct dialog options, there is an explanation (however feeble it is). This isn't the old B-guy the new B-guy took the old one's name ...and bones, apparently.

Exactly this. Balthazar is a fraud, that's why he's so different. That actually makes him a pretty good character in my eyes.

Nothing is more atrocious than the way they treated Sarevok and Viconia. Sarevok was somebody always guided by self-interest, with Bhaal worship only being a ruse for him to achieve his own interests, and then BG3 depicted him as a Bhaal fanatic.

Same for Viconia, in BG2 she had a "redemption arc" and became a true neutral character. In BG3 she's once again a Shar fanatic for some stupid reason.

Though from what I've read it's mostly WOTC's fault, not Larian. Though Larian could always have simply not used them if they were aware of the way they were treated.

Doesn't she only have the 'redemption arc' if you romance her? Been a while. Either way, BG2 Viconia romance was made non-canon by Neverwinter.

[Anon]

I think that if you follow the correct dialog options, there is an explanation (however feeble it is). This isn't the old B-guy the new B-guy took the old one's name ...and bones, apparently.

Exactly this. Balthazar is a fraud, that's why he's so different. That actually makes him a pretty good character in my eyes.

Nothing is more atrocious than the way they treated Sarevok and Viconia. Sarevok was somebody always guided by self-interest, with Bhaal worship only being a ruse for him to achieve his own interests, and then BG3 depicted him as a Bhaal fanatic.

Same for Viconia, in BG2 she had a "redemption arc" and became a true neutral character. In BG3 she's once again a Shar fanatic for some stupid reason.

Though from what I've read it's mostly WOTC's fault, not Larian. Though Larian could always have simply not used them if they were aware of the way they were treated.

Doesn't she only have the 'redemption arc' if you romance her? Been a while. Either way, BG2 Viconia romance was made non-canon by Neverwinter.

Yes to former question. Thought it was made canon though. Regardless, even as evil, BG1 and 2 Viconia didn't strike me as being the fanatic ****** she is in BG3. Btw yes it's the WOTC work that's at fault for ruining both Viconia and Sarevok's canon as I said.

[Shillitron]

Exactly this. Balthazar is a fraud, that's why he's so different. That actually makes him a pretty good character in my eyes.

It's still a convoluted excuse to shoe horn a character into BG3 as a call back ..
BG3 does this all the time too.. The amount of diaries I find from Menzoberranzan Drow from house Do'Urden.. just buried in the floor 5 feet outside Baldur's Gate.

It's so sloppy.

Fair point that it's not the same Balthazar but it's not "good" either. It's lame.

[buttfucker 3000]

If you pass a history skill check when talking to Balthazar, he'll tell you that he's not actually him, but just took his name and ribs because it "suits him better".

[Anon]

Exactly this. Balthazar is a fraud, that's why he's so different. That actually makes him a pretty good character in my eyes.

It's still a convoluted excuse to shoe horn a character into BG3 as a call back ..
BG3 does this all the time too.. The amount of diaries I find from Menzoberranzan Drow from house Do'Urden.. just buried in the floor 5 feet outside Baldur's Gate.

It's so sloppy.

Fair point that it's not the same Balthazar but it's not "good" either. It's lame.

I mean it's a continuation of BG universe so of course there need to be some throwbacks. Imo it was a well executed one but I may be biased because I really like BG3 Balthazar as well, he kicks *** and has a pretty funny and memorable personality, an excellent secondary villain

I agree with your overall criticism though, Larian's writing is like swiss cheese, full of holes.

[gastovski]

this 100 years of crap really ****** this up imo

aylin actually being imprisoned that long and her gf waited for this long? wtf

[fkirenicus]

Nothing is more atrocious than the way they treated Sarevok and Viconia. Sarevok was somebody always guided by self-interest, with Bhaal worship only being a ruse for him to achieve his own interests, and then BG3 depicted him as a Bhaal fanatic.

Same for Viconia, in BG2 she had a "redemption arc" and became a true neutral character. In BG3 she's once again a Shar fanatic for some stupid reason.

I seldom used Vic in my BG playthroughs, but yes - she appears to be more "normal" about her Shar worshipping in the old games. Sarevok on the other hand, I even had redemption for, through a mod I always used. Both him and Irenicus, actually, in ToB (and both required Ascension). Well. Since both are non-canon, I guess Larian can do whatever they want. I seem to remember though that even without mods, you could get Sarevok starting to ponder his identiy which basically led him at least from CE to CN in game terms, maybe. And yes, he never a die-hard Bhaalist; in fact, he didn't serve Bhaal himself - he wanted to take Bhaal's powers for himself.

What really bugs me (for now, haven't seen any explanation yet) is the recurrence of characters without long lifespan. Minsc. Sarevok too, since I resurrected him as a human in ToB, without any godlike-powers at all (and Minsc never had them). Vic and Jaheira are plausible given their race, but that Minsc should live to be 150 years old or so given the lifespan of humans - no.

Finally, a note on the Emperor: yet another resurrection of a historically important character, excruciatingly feebly written into the story, so far as I as I have been able to sneak-peek (haven't come to the moment in the game where he reveals his identity yet).

[Anon]

Nothing is more atrocious than the way they treated Sarevok and Viconia. Sarevok was somebody always guided by self-interest, with Bhaal worship only being a ruse for him to achieve his own interests, and then BG3 depicted him as a Bhaal fanatic.

Same for Viconia, in BG2 she had a "redemption arc" and became a true neutral character. In BG3 she's once again a Shar fanatic for some stupid reason.

I seldom used Vic in my BG playthroughs, but yes - she appears to be more "normal" about her Shar worshipping in the old games. Sarevok on the other hand, I even had redemption for, through a mod I always used. Both him and Irenicus, actually, in ToB (and both required Ascension). Well. Since both are non-canon, I guess Larian can do whatever they want. I seem to remember though that even without mods, you could get Sarevok starting to ponder his identiy which basically led him at least from CE to CN in game terms, maybe. And yes, he never a die-hard Bhaalist; in fact, he didn't serve Bhaal himself - he wanted to take Bhaal's powers for himself.

What really bugs me (for now, haven't seen any explanation yet) is the recurrence of characters without long lifespan. Minsc. Sarevok too, since I resurrected him as a human in ToB, without any godlike-powers at all (and Minsc never had them). Vic and Jaheira are plausible given their race, but that Minsc should live to be 150 years old or so given the lifespan of humans - no.

Finally, a note on the Emperor: yet another resurrection of a historically important character, excruciatingly feebly written into the story, so far as I as I have been able to sneak-peek (haven't come to the moment in the game where he reveals his identity yet).

Minsc survived all this long because he has become petrified, I don't remember the details though.

For Sarevok, Bhaal revives him according to a book ingame

[jebacdrkac]

Canon endings are most of the time just pure laziness and greed excuse, like it would take so much effort and money to make separate characters for those who redeemed saverok and viconia...both of them had like 30 lines combined and 5 min of screentime

[Shillitron]

\Bhaal revives him according to a book ingame

The god of murder, who is dead, is bringing people back to life.

You heard it here first folks - A+ writing.

[orinEsque]

Viconia. Sarevok, saggy Jaheira. And ofcourse Minsc(cringe)