Souls-Sloppa

[W1llus]

Figured it would be nice to have a dedicated thread to contain discussion on all things souls-like considering we're getting what......3-4 games in that style releasing this year alone. On that note code vein 2 comes out in 3 days and Nioh 3 in a little over a week. Code Vein 2 has been somewhat censored compared to the prior title. Npc's still have big booba and you can increase you breast size (to a moderate degree) but they put these awkward black shorts under specific clothing that didn't exist before in the prior title. Bandai going woke is nothing new but it's now more noticeably bleeding into Japanese games and people are taking notice. Localization from what I've been told is also somewhat suspect and people have pointed out some odd mistranslations in the dialogue. I of course will take one for the team and give my thoughts. Hopefully writing a review for that will be a lot easier then trying to write a review for Silksong was.

(2019)


(2026)

[Decline]

I find all of these souls likes incredibly boring.

[Algol]

I adore soulslikes and I think there needs to be more of them. Quality ones, of course.

[DDC]

Well at least they managed to make massive improvements in overall graphical fidelity during the intervening 7 years. lmao

[wndrbr]

Most of the souls-inspired games are missing the point in a similar way to how fromsoft themselves started missing it after a few games.

Souls games became popular because they went against the trend of overly-tropey and predictable cinematic action games that treated the played like a newborn. So the main reason people liked Dark Souls was the experience of getting thrown into an unusual world and having to learn how it works. For the experience to continue being fresh, new Souls games should've kept introducing new memorable curveballs - stuff like the mimic chests, Patches kicking you in the back, Yurt killing friendly NPCs in the game's main hub, skeletons coming back to life even after you killed them, areas being full of environmental hazards, friendly NPCs being killable and then never coming back after you kill them, the rolling save file preventing you from savescumming and forcing you to live with the consequences of your actions, Maldron the Assassin wearing a white phantom ring to fool you, etc etc.

Instead those games started abusing their own tropes, became predictable, turned into glorified boss-rush games with most of the 'content' inbetween the bossfights feeling like padding.

[wndrbr]

I liked Nioh 1 and 2, mostly because they were less of 'souls-likes' and more of diablo-like buildporn action rpgs. Nioh 3, however, doesn't look all that enticing. Nioh 1 and 2 were already teetering on the edge of feeling overdesigned, and N3's character switching looks like the final straw to break the camel's back. Another annoying little thing to manage in a game already bloated with unnecessary mechanics.

[W1llus]

I liked Nioh 1 and 2, mostly because they were less of 'souls-likes' and more of diablo-like buildporn action rpgs. Nioh 3, however, doesn't look all that enticing. Nioh 1 and 2 were already teetering on the edge of feeling overdesigned, and N3's character switching looks like the final straw to break the camel's back. Another annoying little thing to manage in a game already bloated with unnecessary mechanics.

I think of all the souls-likes nioh deviated the most into becoming its own thing. even calling nioh 1 a souls-like is misleading. Going into it expecting the combat or loot from any of the fromsoft games and you're in for a rude awakening. I think Nioh 2 was an improvement over nioh 1 in just about every way but the mechanical bloat is worrying. im looking forward to nioh 3 though. its still unapologetically japanese and it isnt self censoring (to my knowledge).

[fork]

Best non-Fromsoft souls-like is Wuchang before they dumbed it down (was easy enough, but some ******* felt it was too hard, so they made enemies easier to stagger, mines more visible, Wuchang's wake-up and healing animations quicker) and censored it, supposedly due to ***** outrage over some historical ******** or whatever.
Pretty cool story, good gameplay with its own takes on the formula, good art direction, best level design since DS2 (in the first 2/3rds, and DS1 obviously still leagues ahead), great bosses. It's UE5 and has its share of problems, but I honestly can't think of a better game in the genre from a dev other than Fromsoft. You play a pre-made character though, and she's kinda hot, so might be too much for some ******* on here.

[W1llus]

Best non-Fromsoft souls-like is Wuchang before they dumbed it down (was easy enough, but some ******* felt it was too hard, so they made enemies easier to stagger, mines more visible, Wuchang's wake-up and healing animations quicker) and censored it, supposedly due to ***** outrage over some historical ******** or whatever.
Pretty cool story, good gameplay with its own takes on the formula, good art direction, best level design since DS2 (in the first 2/3rds, and DS1 obviously still leagues ahead), great bosses. It's UE5 and has its share of problems, but I honestly can't think of a better game in the genre from a dev other than Fromsoft. You play a pre-made character though, and she's kinda hot, so might be too much for some ******* on here.

Personally for me Lies of P is currently the best souls-like. It takes elements from fromsoftwares game and either does them better or rightfully tosses them out and does something different. The customizable weapons are genuinely fun and creative, the level design while linear, is excellent, the story is actually really good which is saying a lot for this genre, the soundtrack is incredible, great graphics, sound design, enemies, etc. I can go on. The one catch is you have to play as a robot twink.

[fork]

Lies of P is awful.
Awful art and level design, complete ****.

You might be a ******.

[DDC]

I liked Nioh 1 and 2, mostly because they were less of 'souls-likes' and more of diablo-like buildporn action rpgs. Nioh 3, however, doesn't look all that enticing. Nioh 1 and 2 were already teetering on the edge of feeling overdesigned, and N3's character switching looks like the final straw to break the camel's back. Another annoying little thing to manage in a game already bloated with unnecessary mechanics.

I thought Nioh 1 was fun enough, but I could not play Nioh 2 with the "ki pulse" mechanic. Just seemed completely unnecessary and detracted from the combat. I'm here to beat the **** out of enemies, not play a timed button press rhythm game. I've beaten most every souls game including the ones that get complained about a lot (and since nerfing became so common I try to rush them so I can beat them pre-nerf), but I did not get very far in Nioh 2 before I shelved it.

Best non-Fromsoft souls-like is Wuchang before they dumbed it down (was easy enough, but some ******* felt it was too hard, so they made enemies easier to stagger, mines more visible, Wuchang's wake-up and healing animations quicker) and censored it, supposedly due to ***** outrage over some historical ******** or whatever.
Pretty cool story, good gameplay with its own takes on the formula, good art direction, best level design since DS2 (in the first 2/3rds, and DS1 obviously still leagues ahead), great bosses. It's UE5 and has its share of problems, but I honestly can't think of a better game in the genre from a dev other than Fromsoft. You play a pre-made character though, and she's kinda hot, so might be too much for some ******* on here.

Liked Wuchang but can't say it's the best (played pre-nerfs). There's about 5-10 nonfrom soulslikes on a similar level or arguably better. Lot of jank but the people complaining had skill issues or refused to change their gear to counter a boss. I remember the Demon of Obsession getting a lot of complaints in particular but I killed it blind first try. I can't say it had good level design because there are tons of places that should be explorable that just auto-kill you into a "pit" if you drop onto what looks like solid ground a few feet below. Seems like it wanted to actively punish you for looking for secrets so I stopped trying. The parry window was also too big and trivialized some fights that should have been more difficult/fun. The bosses are nowhere close to what Berserker Khazan offers. With wuchang you get C+ level design compared to Khazan C-, but a case can be made that Khazan had the best bosses of any souls game which I don't think you can say about Wuchang with a straigh face. Then there's also stuff like Lies of P, Code Vein, Lords of the Fallen, Surge 2, etc that I liked about as much as wuchang.

[wndrbr]

I liked Nioh 1 and 2, mostly because they were less of 'souls-likes' and more of diablo-like buildporn action rpgs. Nioh 3, however, doesn't look all that enticing. Nioh 1 and 2 were already teetering on the edge of feeling overdesigned, and N3's character switching looks like the final straw to break the camel's back. Another annoying little thing to manage in a game already bloated with unnecessary mechanics.

I thought Nioh 1 was fun enough, but I could not play Nioh 2 with the "ki pulse" mechanic. Just seemed completely unnecessary and detracted from the combat. I'm here to beat the **** out of enemies, not play a timed button press rhythm game. I've beaten most every souls game including the ones that get complained about a lot (and since nerfing became so common I try to rush them so I can beat them pre-nerf), but I did not get very far in Nioh 2 before I shelved it.

but ki-pulse was in Nioh 1 too. Maybe you meant the burst counter?

I played both Nioh games on a keyboard, and the sheer amount of different abilities and special counters made it impossible to map all of them in a comfortable way. Because of that I never properly learned how to use them. I never even learned how to do the dynamic stance-switching during the combat cuz it was too cumbersome to execute. Both games were still perfectly playable and beatable.

[fork]

Best non-Fromsoft souls-like is Wuchang before they dumbed it down (was easy enough, but some ******* felt it was too hard, so they made enemies easier to stagger, mines more visible, Wuchang's wake-up and healing animations quicker) and censored it, supposedly due to ***** outrage over some historical ******** or whatever.
Pretty cool story, good gameplay with its own takes on the formula, good art direction, best level design since DS2 (in the first 2/3rds, and DS1 obviously still leagues ahead), great bosses. It's UE5 and has its share of problems, but I honestly can't think of a better game in the genre from a dev other than Fromsoft. You play a pre-made character though, and she's kinda hot, so might be too much for some ******* on here.

Liked Wuchang but can't say it's the best (played pre-nerfs). There's about 5-10 nonfrom soulslikes on a similar level or arguably better. Lot of jank but the people complaining had skill issues or refused to change their gear to counter a boss. I remember the Demon of Obsession getting a lot of complaints in particular but I killed it blind first try. I can't say it had good level design because there are tons of places that should be explorable that just auto-kill you into a "pit" if you drop onto what looks like solid ground a few feet below. Seems like it wanted to actively punish you for looking for secrets so I stopped trying. The parry window was also too big and trivialized some fights that should have been more difficult/fun. The bosses are nowhere close to what Berserker Khazan offers. With wuchang you get C+ level design compared to Khazan C-, but a case can be made that Khazan had the best bosses of any souls game which I don't think you can say about Wuchang with a straigh face. Then there's also stuff like Lies of P, Code Vein, Lords of the Fallen, Surge 2, etc that I liked about as much as wuchang.

Khazan has **** level-design, horrific art design, terrible systems, so does Code Vein. I actually liked The Surge 1, but it had no enemy variety and the bosses were **** (also worse level design, Surge 2 is beyond awful), Lies of P has **** level design and awful art all around. Lords of the Fallen is complete crap in every way.
WTF are you on? 5 to 10 that are arguably better? You mention 5 or so, all of which are worse than Wuchang at everything that makes DS1 great.
Whatever, **** taste. Have fun eating ****.

Edit:
You didn't even mention closer contenders, like Nioh (good combat, everything else ****), Hellpoint (great level design, good concept and atmosphere, everything else ****), Mortal shell (great atmosphere and gameplay, everything else ****). Wuchang is by far the best of the souls-clones. Everything is at least mediocre, with most aspects being good and a few even surpassing DS. It's a shame this game only got negative attention after release for the awful patches (in the West) and some inane bs pre-patches in ***** land, because it basically killed any chances for an even better sequel, maybe even the studio.

[wndrbr]

@fork have you played Hellpoint?

It's a souls game that takes place in a wh40k-style space station that's orbiting the black hole, and the main character is some kind of 3d-printed golem working for the station's AI. Production values, animations, enemy variety is rather poor, but it has this genuine feel to it, like it was made by eager people who were more concerned with creating a fun and unusual game rather than 'let's just make a soulless carbon copy to dupe the souls fans'. It's also very open-ended, and can be finished in a variety of different ways.

[fork]

Yeah, I played some of it, see my edited post above.
It has great level design, atmosphere and setting are superb, but everything else is awful. Stopped playing 1/3rd of the way in or so.

[DDC]

I liked Nioh 1 and 2, mostly because they were less of 'souls-likes' and more of diablo-like buildporn action rpgs. Nioh 3, however, doesn't look all that enticing. Nioh 1 and 2 were already teetering on the edge of feeling overdesigned, and N3's character switching looks like the final straw to break the camel's back. Another annoying little thing to manage in a game already bloated with unnecessary mechanics.

I thought Nioh 1 was fun enough, but I could not play Nioh 2 with the "ki pulse" mechanic. Just seemed completely unnecessary and detracted from the combat. I'm here to beat the **** out of enemies, not play a timed button press rhythm game. I've beaten most every souls game including the ones that get complained about a lot (and since nerfing became so common I try to rush them so I can beat them pre-nerf), but I did not get very far in Nioh 2 before I shelved it.

but ki-pulse was in Nioh 1 too. Maybe you meant the burst counter?

I played both Nioh games on a keyboard, and the sheer amount of different abilities and special counters made it impossible to map all of them in a comfortable way. Because of that I never properly learned how to use them. I never even learned how to do the dynamic stance-switching during the combat cuz it was too cumbersome to execute. Both games were still perfectly playable and beatable.

I now have no idea what I was talking about. Looking it up, the mechanic that specifically ****** me off in Nioh 2 was having to do perfect ki pulses to dissipate the "yokai realm." But apparently Nioh 1 had the same mechanic, although I have no recollection of it. Maybe I was willing to tolerate it in 2017 and then four years later by the time Nioh 2 came out I had forgotten about it. Or maybe it was way more intrusive in Nioh 2.

[W1llus]

I've played a good chunk of the souls likes. Nioh 1 and 2 are so different they spawned their own sub-genre recently with khazan the first berserker being what I would call the first "nioh-like". It has a lot of QoL over nioh and its a much easier point of entry not having so many mechanics. I hate this blur filter the devs put on every level had to mod it out because it was making me sick and also how generic a lot of the early game levels and mobs are. Khazan does have some stellar boss fights though.

[Maledict]

Thanks to this thread I unwishlisted Nioh and wishlisted Hellpoint. I hate excessive mechanics.

[W1llus]

Yeah, I played some of it, see my edited post above.
It has great level design, atmosphere and setting are superb, but everything else is awful. Stopped playing 1/3rd of the way in or so.

Part of that is the game was developed with a shoe string budget since the kickstart barely limped over the finish line. Actually got to test it while it was still in development. One of those games I wish actually did well financially on Kickstarter. Then again more money does not always mean a better product.

Thanks to this thread I unwishlisted Nioh and wishlisted Hellpoint. I hate excessive mechanics.

Just be prepared Hellpoint is very janky and it has mandatory platforming sections if you want specific endings. You'll likely need to look up some guides since the game does a poor job explaining some of its systems. I think Nioh 1 and 2 both go on sale for cheap so if you want to give either a chance id grab it then and if you don't like it refund it.

[rusty_shackleford]

There are no souls-likes, there's barely even three souls games
There are games that copy the boring combat of later dork souls games and make it worse

[Maledict]

You'll likely need to look up some guides since the game does a poor job explaining some of its systems.

So like fromsoft? Got it.

[Bertram_Tung]

There are no souls-likes

There are games that copy...souls games...

Okay, champ. *pats head*

[Vaako]

Was obvious from the trailer when they censored the cleavage in the second game, when the first advertised with that. And the gameplay or world in the first game was not memorable at all for me. Not even worth sailing the seas for this.
English translation they have also ruined apparently "madness" is "bigotry" in this, says the guy here.

[Stack of Turtles]

Figured it would be nice to have a dedicated thread to contain discussion on all things souls-like considering we're getting what......3-4 games in that style releasing this year alone. On that note code vein 2 comes out in 3 days and Nioh 3 in a little over a week. Code Vein 2 has been somewhat censored compared to the prior title. Npc's still have big booba and you can increase you breast size (to a moderate degree) but they put these awkward black shorts under specific clothing that didn't exist before in the prior title. Bandai going woke is nothing new but it's now more noticeably bleeding into Japanese games and people are taking notice. Localization from what I've been told is also somewhat suspect and people have pointed out some odd mistranslations in the dialogue. I of course will take one for the team and give my thoughts. Hopefully writing a review for that will be a lot easier then trying to write a review for Silksong was.

(2019)


(2026)

Would it have been woke if they made it without the panty shot in the first place?

[W1llus]

The reviews are in and code vein 2 ranges from mediocre to okay depending on who you ask. I'll give my own thoughts eventually. My big thing is they had 7 YEARS to take a solid foundation and improve it and they didn't.

[LemonDemonGirl]

The character creator is ok though

[WhiteShark]

Figured it would be nice to have a dedicated thread to contain discussion on all things souls-like considering we're getting what......3-4 games in that style releasing this year alone. On that note code vein 2 comes out in 3 days and Nioh 3 in a little over a week. Code Vein 2 has been somewhat censored compared to the prior title. Npc's still have big booba and you can increase you breast size (to a moderate degree) but they put these awkward black shorts under specific clothing that didn't exist before in the prior title. Bandai going woke is nothing new but it's now more noticeably bleeding into Japanese games and people are taking notice. Localization from what I've been told is also somewhat suspect and people have pointed out some odd mistranslations in the dialogue. I of course will take one for the team and give my thoughts. Hopefully writing a review for that will be a lot easier then trying to write a review for Silksong was.

(2019)


(2026)

Would it have been woke if they made it without the panty shot in the first place?

You'd have to take away clothing customization or free camera look to avoid it, presumably. Those don't sound like appealing alternatives.

[Finarfin]

Dodged a bullet with Chode Vein 2, gonna go with NIOH 3 instead.

[stormvermin]

Doubt Nioh 3 will come close to 2 or even 1. That Wo-Chong or whatever it was called game and Rise of the Ronin both sucked and I think that solidified Team Ninja's trajectory.
Code Vein 1 was bad and so was God Eater for that matter. Not surprising that the sequel shaped up to be mediocre.

I've played a good chunk of the souls likes. Nioh 1 and 2 are so different they spawned their own sub-genre recently with khazan the first berserker being what I would call the first "nioh-like". It has a lot of QoL over nioh and its a much easier point of entry not having so many mechanics. I hate this blur filter the devs put on every level had to mod it out because it was making me sick and also how generic a lot of the early game levels and mobs are. Khazan does have some stellar boss fights though.

Khazan is legit as ****. It's criminal how much the game flew under the radar. Double agree on the boss fights; Skalpel is one of my favorite vidya bosses in recent years.
I don't think it sold all that well and I doubt we're getting a sequel, even though I think it's part of some chinkslop gacha phone game IP.

[Finarfin]

lol lmao even
>Wolong and RotR sucked.
Good Joke *****