RPG Ranking Thread

[Tangerine]

Also are Zelda games really RPG's?

No.

[Jordy]

I'll contribute if the OP feels like updating still.

1. The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
2. Dragon Age: Origins
3. Mass Effect
4. Dragon's Dogma
5. Fable 2. I didn't see this on the list so if I can't vote for it I'll go with Fable 1.

I will say I'm surprised to see Kingdom Come Deliverance ranked so highly. Not a bad game but interesting choice by the users here. Also are Zelda games really RPG's? I love Zelda but never would have thought to call them role playing games.

I'll give it a few days to see if anymore come in before I update.

I look up each game and if it's stated anywhere to be an RPG I'll add it and the community can speak up if they don't agree. I think at some point I just couldn't be bothered nannying the stupidity and skipped the first step.

[Valter]

5. Fable 2. I didn't see this on the list so if I can't vote for it I'll go with Fable 1.

The list is comprised by user entries. Choose your Fable 2 and whatever else you like, king

[maidenhaver]

It's crazy that I've yet to play any of the top ten games listed here. Never heard of Planescape: Torment until today. Is it that good?

Here's my list:

1. Baldur's Gate 3

2. Mass Effect Trilogy (2's my favourite)

3. Skyrim

4. Bloodborne

5. Xenoblade Chronicles 2

I've only beaten 2 of the top 5, and only learned of them through friends. It just makes us filthy casuals, that's all.

I wouldn't consider myself a casual gamer when I'm usually up to the early hours playing anything from a niche JRPG to the latest AAA slop. I just bought those top 10 games on GOG since there's a sale on right now. They were all dirt cheap. Threw the first Fallout on just to see what it was like and I was totally into it from the get-go. Looking forward to playing them all.

Unless you played the top ten the day they released, you are casual.

[jdcp]

Also are Zelda games really RPG's? I love Zelda but never would have thought to call them role playing games.

They are action games with a bit of RPG DNA in their design, but the "roleplaying" aspect of it is so mild you can't really call it RPG.

What makes an RPG is a strong narrative design (though it varies in th way this "narrative" is done, refer to Pokemon). Zelda despite being great games completely lack this.

Even grandiose tales such as Majoras Mask or Twilight Princess don't offer much in that regard, and the more simplistic approaches such as the nes, snes and gameboy games don't bring anything more either.

One could argue many other games considered RPGs have an even worse design than Zelda in that sense, but that's not because we are being unfair in the classification, it's because they're bad RPGs.

Being a bad RPG doesn't make you a bad game, refer to Fallout 4 (though opinions differ, general concensus is that it's a fun game) for a good example, but if you were to judge Zelda for it's RPG aspect, then it's terrible.

And let's not start with BOTW and the sequel because you're gonna get a big rant from me.

Not a bad game but interesting choice by the users here

Unsurprising to be honest, it's got great world design and mechanics, it's a good example of what an RPG is.

[Acrux]

What makes an RPG is a strong narrative design

Is Wizardry an RPG?

[J1M]

I recently learned that the definition of RPG is "has visible damage numbers that go up".

Turns out all of those Codex discussions were superfluous.

[jdcp]

Is Wizardry an RPG?

Don't play dumb with me, you know it is, so look well into what I wrote

RPG is a strong narrative design (though it varies in th way this "narrative" is done, refer to Pokemon

Wizardry is about making a team and carrying forward a dungeon with it.

That's the narrative of Wizardry.

Zelda's game design is not about "following a role" it's about clearing dungeons and solving puzzles and minigames.

I recently learned that the definition of RPG is "has visible damage numbers that go up".

Turns out all of those Codex discussions were superfluous.

It's not that hard, but it really depends on the emphasis that is put into the "role" as much as it is put into the "playing"

It's very different a game with RPG elements than an actual RPG, look into SOTN.

That's not an RPG, it's a game with RPG stuff.

[Acrux]

Is Wizardry an RPG?

Don't play dumb with me, you know it is, so look well into what I wrote

I wasn't. There are some people on this board who would say that it is not.

[J1M]

Is Wizardry an RPG?

Don't play dumb with me, you know it is, so look well into what I wrote

I wasn't. There are some people on this board who would say that it is not.

My first Wizardry game was Wizardry VI. I concluded that "Wizardry 6 is a bad adventure game that takes place in a maze. There is also combat to make it longer."

Haven't heard anything about that series changing genres, so I would assume Wizardry I is the same.

[rusty_shackleford]

Don't play dumb with me, you know it is, so look well into what I wrote

I wasn't. There are some people on this board who would say that it is not.

My first Wizardry game was Wizardry VI. I concluded that "Wizardry 6 is a bad adventure game that takes place in a maze. There is also combat to make it longer."

Haven't heard anything about that series changing genres, so I would assume Wizardry I is the same.

Wizardry 8 is much better if you haven't played it

[jdcp]

I wasn't. There are some people on this board who would say that it is not.

drugs do bad kids.

Surprised, I thought most if not all here knew their stuff.

Wizardry 8 is much better if you haven't played it

Agree

My first was Wizardry 8, pretty decent game all in all. Ugly as a sin but entertaining, not the best imo.

Haven't heard anything about that series changing genres, so I would assume Wizardry I is the same.

Yes, it's a very enclosed approach to RPG, very barebones, but it's alright.

That doesn't mean it is not.

You gotta remember this **** came in 1981, and it was alright. You couldn't really ask for anything better back then I guess.

[J1M]

I care a lot more about drawing a circle around what is a "real sport" than what is a "real RPG", but here's something to think about since RPG gets debated a lot. If an adventure game can be an RPG, if a maze navigating game can be an RPG, if an immersive sim can be an RPG, are you left with reducto ad absurdum? To the point where the defining trait of an RPG is "numbers that go up" or "subpar combat"?

► Show Spoiler

Races, contests, activities, and games can be exercise, but that doesn't make them sports.

[rusty_shackleford]

the definition of RPG depends not just on the contents of the game, but also when it was released

[J1M]

the definition of RPG depends not just on the contents of the game, but also when it was released

Are there any other genres you would apply this standard to?

[Baldric]

I'll contribute if the OP feels like updating still.

1. The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
2. Dragon Age: Origins
3. Mass Effect
4. Dragon's Dogma
5. Fable 2. I didn't see this on the list so if I can't vote for it I'll go with Fable 1.

I will say I'm surprised to see Kingdom Come Deliverance ranked so highly. Not a bad game but interesting choice by the users here. Also are Zelda games really RPG's? I love Zelda but never would have thought to call them role playing games.

Dragon Age is underrated; I have some good memories playing that back in the day.

[Valter]

I'll contribute if the OP feels like updating still.

1. The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
2. Dragon Age: Origins
3. Mass Effect
4. Dragon's Dogma
5. Fable 2. I didn't see this on the list so if I can't vote for it I'll go with Fable 1.

I will say I'm surprised to see Kingdom Come Deliverance ranked so highly. Not a bad game but interesting choice by the users here. Also are Zelda games really RPG's? I love Zelda but never would have thought to call them role playing games.

Dragon Age is underrated; I have some good memories playing that back in the day.

I like it too, but I'm not sure I'd call the #2 ranker of this forum's Top RPGs list "underrated".

And even in the era it came out, it was a top dog among online discourse regarding RPGs.

[rusty_shackleford]

the definition of RPG depends not just on the contents of the game, but also when it was released

Are there any other genres you would apply this standard to?

no because RPG is the ur-genre

like how most post-ultima underworld "RPGs" aren't really RPGs

[jdcp]

Are there any other genres you would apply this standard to?

Heretic and Hexen (primarily the later one, as Heretic is more of a fun fantasy skin for Doom than anything) would have been considered RPGs before Wolfenstein set the bases for the FPS genre to be recognized as a genre.

In the dark times, before the age of Doom had come, the closest thing to an FPS you had were very mild, so mild you could barely call them that.

So happens with Wizardry, you might not agree with it today, but as I said that was an RPG back then.

Rusty is right, but I'll also had that the intentions of the developer also matter. Otherwise we wouldn't call Fallout 4 a bad RPG, we would call it a bad sandbox tower defense game.

Dragon Age is underrated; I have some good memories playing that back in the day.

Agree

Same, they used to be good games up until Inquisition.

[jdcp]

no because RPG is the ur-genre

like how most post-ultima underworld "RPGs" aren't really RPGs

I must add too that while my example is valid (at least in my opinion), you're right here once again.

RPG is a genre that entangles many many things, and as I said, it takes a lot of forms, many completely devoid of what an RPG initially standed for.

This is not bad, just a byproduct of evolution

Look at it this way Wizardry > Baldurs Gate > The Elder Scrolls post Morrowind

Very different games, , different approaches, different ages, nevertheless all RPGs.

I care a lot more about drawing a circle around what is a "real sport" than what is a "real RPG", but here's something to think about since RPG gets debated a lot. If an adventure game can be an RPG, if a maze navigating game can be an RPG, if an immersive sim can be an RPG, are you left with reducto ad absurdum? To the point where the defining trait of an RPG is "numbers that go up" or "subpar combat"?

I must also add that this is a very good example, anything can be an sport if competition gets inbetween, anything can be an RPG if you design it to be an RPG.

Refer to an MMO and an MMORPG to see an example of this.

The thing here is not that you are wrong in your definition of it, is that you're wrong in your approach it. Nobody should deny your definition as it is indeed right, problem is you're intending that definition to stand the test of time when it won't.

Things change, but were not gonna deny the egyptians from such a great feat as the pyramids are just because slavery has been outlawed nowadays, are we? Bad example, but similar.

[maidenhaver]

you're right here once again.

God help us.

No wonder he doesn't delete indians.

[J1M]

Are there any other genres you would apply this standard to?

Heretic and Hexen (primarily the later one, as Heretic is more of a fun fantasy skin for Doom than anything) would have been considered RPGs before Wolfenstein set the bases for the FPS genre to be recognized as a genre.

In the dark times, before the age of Doom had come, the closest thing to an FPS you had were very mild, so mild you could barely call them that.

So happens with Wizardry, you might not agree with it today, but as I said that was an RPG back then.

Rusty is right, but I'll also had that the intentions of the developer also matter. Otherwise we wouldn't call Fallout 4 a bad RPG, we would call it a bad sandbox tower defense game.

Dragon Age is underrated; I have some good memories playing that back in the day.

Agree

Same, they used to be good games up until Inquisition.

Nice try, but I can't let someone casually refer to Dragon Age 2 as a 'good game'.

[rusty_shackleford]

The more time goes on, the more subgenres will continue to accumulate as RPG becomes more all-encompassing.
People will argue whether Wizardry can meet the definition of an RPG, but few if any would argue whether it meets the definition of DRPG(it is essentially the definition of such), which is itself a subset of RPG, therefore Wizardry must be an RPG but only a single facet of the entire genre.

Backsliding has happened, but progress will resume eventually.

[jdcp]

No wonder he doesn't delete indians.

What do you mean?

[J1M]

no because RPG is the ur-genre

like how most post-ultima underworld "RPGs" aren't really RPGs

I must add too that while my example is valid (at least in my opinion), you're right here once again.

RPG is a genre that entangles many many things, and as I said, it takes a lot of forms, many completely devoid of what an RPG initially standed for.

This is not bad, just a byproduct of evolution

Look at it this way Wizardry > Baldurs Gate > The Elder Scrolls post Morrowind

Very different games, , different approaches, different ages, nevertheless all RPGs.

I care a lot more about drawing a circle around what is a "real sport" than what is a "real RPG", but here's something to think about since RPG gets debated a lot. If an adventure game can be an RPG, if a maze navigating game can be an RPG, if an immersive sim can be an RPG, are you left with reducto ad absurdum? To the point where the defining trait of an RPG is "numbers that go up" or "subpar combat"?

I must also add that this is a very good example, anything can be an sport if competition gets inbetween, anything can be an RPG if you design it to be an RPG.

Refer to an MMO and an MMORPG to see an example of this.

The thing here is not that you are wrong in your definition of it, is that you're wrong in your approach it. Nobody should deny your definition as it is indeed right, problem is you're intending that definition to stand the test of time when it won't.

Things change, but were not gonna deny the egyptians from such a great feat as the pyramids are just because slavery has been outlawed nowadays, are we? Bad example, but similar.

High jump isn't a sport. It's a contest.

A real sport needs to incorporate more than one dimension, such that in theory three teams could have a rock-paper-scissors relationship.

[jdcp]

High jump isn't a sport. It's a contest.

A real sport needs to incorporate more than one dimension, such that in theory three teams could have a rock-paper-scissors relationship.

Do we live in the same dimension?

High Jump is a sport.

[Stack of Turtles]

High jump isn't a sport, it's one single action. If high jump is a sport then the spacebar is a video game.

[jdcp]

High jump isn't a sport, it's one single action. If high jump is a sport then the spacebar is a video game.

Yes because an athlete trained for the 365 days of a year all day all night and bled sweat to win a spacebar competition.

What the **** are these arguments?

[Stack of Turtles]

High jump isn't a sport, it's one single action. If high jump is a sport then the spacebar is a video game.

Yes because an athlete trained for the 365 days of a year all day all night and bled sweat to win a spacebar competition.

What the **** are these arguments?

Who cares how much work went into it? What, are you a Marxist? Is this labor theory of value for sports?

[Oyster Sauce]

High jump isn't a sport. It's a contest.

A real sport needs to incorporate more than one dimension, such that in theory three teams could have a rock-paper-scissors relationship.

Do we live in the same dimension?

High Jump is a sport.

Jumping is just a thing you can do. It's like making going prone as fast as possible a sport.