Random (M)MORPG thoughts

[Oyster Sauce]

Are there any MMOs where gear autism isn't the primary focus?

viewtopic.php?p=198089-what-is-the-leas ... mo#p198089

Runescape

[Vergil]

Are there any MMOs where gear autism isn't the primary focus?

viewtopic.php?p=198089-what-is-the-leas ... mo#p198089

Runescape

I thought there was a thread for this but I was too le tired to search.

[rusty_shackleford]

tired of tards saying MMOs died because they were just chatrooms
who the **** came up with this ******** opinion and how can I have them tortured and murdered by a mexican cartel

[rusty_shackleford]

Do you ever think about the last time you logged out of a game you put hundreds/thousands of hours into?

[rusty_shackleford]

Wee Rusty put a ton of time into various korean MMOs
Here's two I put a lot of time into tho


I played a Taoist on the official servers. This is definitely a lot of patches after I played. You can see him harvesting deer to get meat, if you used a fireball to kill it instead you'd burn the meat and the meat would be worthless, I thought that was really neat.

Lineage

Played the knight class

[rusty_shackleford]

Helbreath. This continues in some form to this day so it's hard to find videos of the original game, so here's some weird video that's almost like a documentary

[rusty_shackleford]

Dragon Raja, this one was really fun. I don't remember too much beyond enjoying it, and there's another game called Dragon Raja now which makes it hard to find anything about it.


I think one of the reason korean MMOs tended to not do well in the west is they're just too PvP centric. If I wanted to play PvP, I'd go play an FPS game.

[Oyster Sauce]

Do you ever think about the last time you logged out of a game you put hundreds/thousands of hours into?

Mostly happens after homosexual pedophiles ruin it so its sort of a "good riddance" moment when I finally let go.

[Norfleet]

I think one of the reason korean MMOs tended to not do well in the west is they're just too PvP centric. If I wanted to play PvP, I'd go play an FPS game.

I've come to realize that PvP games with persistence, particularly world-control, are functionally limited-lifespan games. At some point, someone will win, effectively becoming so dominant that opposing them has become impractical. I have been that winner before. The game is functionally over at that point. It can limp along for awhile after with public activity confined to the "safe" zones, and maybe persist in such a state until the winner finally gets bored and quits playing, but if the game is not able to tough it out that long, moves from "over" to "dead". Size appears to be critical here: Eve can apparently manage to limp along this way because even in the shadow of a colossus dominating everything, there's enough space that sufficient numbers of people can just not notice or care, but a smaller game with a smaller base will probably just dwindle to nothing after someone wins.

[methoxetamine]

Do you ever think about the last time you logged out of a game you put hundreds/thousands of hours into?

Mostly happens after homosexual pedophiles ruin it so its sort of a "good riddance" moment when I finally let go.

Based Blizzard making it easy to let go.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Do you ever think about the last time you logged out of a game you put hundreds/thousands of hours into?

No. I have never had a "I am quitting, this is where I am logging off for the last time ever!" moment. It is just for whatever reason, I don't feel like playing today, so I don't log in, and become preoccupied with other games or shows or books or projects. So I am just not thinking about it until I hear about something that makes me want to resume.

In retrospect, the only MMO I have sunk hundreds of hours into that I definitely think I will not revisit (the official servers at least) is ACE Online. It was pretty clear after my first 2 or 3 years of playing it that the Korean devs had effectively abandoned the game and put it into maintenance mode. We got the 3.0 expansion that added Valatus and a dozen new maps on the new continent and the third capturable guild base, and then that was it. There was a so-called "4.0" patch, but IIRC it only redesigned the two capital cities and maybe added a couple of bonus maps. So the game was becoming stagnant, and you can only do the weekly mothership war campaign pushing against the enemy faction's capital and destroying their mothership so many times before it becomes boring. The server population was also bleeding, and then the publisher Subagames added an actual, literal P2W slot machine in the capital cities that you could walk up to, spin with the cash shop money and it would spit out the most powerful armors in the game, including recolours of the most prestigious world boss armors and also new tacky stuff that did not look immersive or appropriate for the setting. I have tried out private servers like Chrome Rivals, but I am just pretty much done.

[anvi]

The holy trinity was a real thing in early EQ and it really sucked. The trinity was Warrior, Cleric, Enchanter. Warrior was essential for raid content because all the knights would get 1 shotted by raid mobs. Warrior clicks Evasive/Defensive discipline and it lets them survive.

Cleric was essential because it was the only healer with full set of heals (hot, group heal, single targets), and the single target heal was big enough to spam on the main tank on raids. (They also had the biggest AC/HP buff) A druid/shm heal was tiny in comparison. Although Dru/Shm were used for patch healing on raids because their heal was fast so they could patch up the main tank and hit anyone else who got injured without the Cleric needing to switch targets. I never cared Druid wasn't much of a healer because they had great damage spells and utility. The Shaman was clever healing because their ability to slow mobs drastically was the equivalent of a heal. The problem was many raid mobs were immune, hence Cleric being the only legit healer.

And then Enchanter, same problem. If you end up being attacked by a bunch of mobs then Ench was the only one who could handle it. They could mez an entire room full of mobs. Bard could too but less reliable. And later Necro could mez single targets. But Ench was the king.

I never minded so much that this was the holy trinity for raid content. I only got annoyed when players started demanding it for group content. You try to put a group together for some basic dungeon like Sebilis or whatever and people would refuse to join unless the tank was a warrior, the healer was a cleric, and the crowd control was an Ench. I even had people refusing to join unless there was an evac. So as a Necro I was **** outta luck. I couldn't main heal, tank, control, or evac.

I liked Vanguard's solution which was to design the classes as archetypes and each class can fulful the basics. So all tanks were fine for groups, and all healers could heal well and rez. The Psionicist was kinda the main crowd control but tanks could aoe taunt so it wasn't really required. The upside is whatever class you pick you can at least get a group and fulfil your main role. The downside is that it risks having the classes be samey. But Vanguard avoided that well, the Cleric was traditional healing, the Disciple healed by beating stuff up like a monk, and the Blood Mage healed with evil magic and life trading.

[logincrash]

I've been thinking about getting back into GW2 or SWTOR, but I'm afraid of getting sucked in and wasting 500 hours again.

[TKVNC]

Are there any MMOs where gear autism isn't the primary focus?

Nah. All MMO's are gear autism.

Everything else is to facilitate, or explain the gear autism. The only real explanation is just: autism.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I've been thinking about getting back into GW2 or SWTOR, but I'm afraid of getting sucked in and wasting 500 hours again.

Where did you last leave off in GW2? Did you reach the soft ending in season 4 or End of Dragons? So far I haven't seen much of a reason to play past EoD.

[rusty_shackleford]

I've been thinking about getting back into GW2 or SWTOR, but I'm afraid of getting sucked in and wasting 500 hours again.

Got a feeling we're going to be doing Star Wars Galaxies sometime soon once @Kalarion & co get bored with their EQ server. Anyone else is welcome to join when we do it.

[logincrash]

I've been thinking about getting back into GW2 or SWTOR, but I'm afraid of getting sucked in and wasting 500 hours again.

Where did you last leave off in GW2? Did you reach the soft ending in season 4 or End of Dragons? So far I haven't seen much of a reason to play past EoD.

I haven't finished the vanilla story yet. I just leveled 4 characters to max level and took part in all the massive events like the undead beach dragon, or the ice dragon from the expansion, or the skittering bug tunnel run, etc.
GW2 is extremely comfy thanks to the player base. I got into it because it was one of the few MMOs with a story but I enjoyed it greatly because of the community.
I got the China expansion and explored the jade city, but I haven't done the story there.

I've been thinking about getting back into GW2 or SWTOR, but I'm afraid of getting sucked in and wasting 500 hours again.

Got a feeling we're going to be doing Star Wars Galaxies sometime soon once @Kalarion & co get bored with their EQ server. Anyone else is welcome to join when we do it.

I thought Star Wars Galaxies was dead?

[rusty_shackleford]

I thought Star Wars Galaxies was dead?

There's popular private servers

[Oyster Sauce]

I think about Runescape a lot and how good it could be if skill training wasn't such a brainless chore. Almost everything else ranges from great to best-in-class, but there's no way I'm going to click a tile 70000 times in order to be able to do high level quests. No clue how I'd fix it without just a flat XP boost though.

[Manny V]

I think about Runescape a lot and how good it could be if skill training wasn't such a brainless chore. Almost everything else ranges from great to best-in-class, but there's no way I'm going to click a tile 70000 times in order to be able to do high level quests. No clue how I'd fix it without just a flat XP boost though.

it helped a bit when they implemented a few new methods to level skills or minigames and what have you to add some variety, but yeah the grind is definitely a big turnoff, the game just becomes a 'turn your brain off and click **** while watching a video or something' sort of thing

[rusty_shackleford]

you guys didn't bot?

[Norfleet]

You can see him harvesting deer to get meat, if you used a fireball to kill it instead you'd burn the meat and the meat would be worthless, I thought that was really neat.

I didn't know people in this game put even more of a premium on raw meat than I did. I mean, I eat raw meat because I'm unwilling to exert the extra effort for what I see as no real gain, not because I would openly refuse to eat it if it were slightly cooked. You're telling me this gameworld is SO fixated on RAW MEAT that there's NOBODY who would pay a premium for pre-cooked deer?

[rusty_shackleford]

You can see him harvesting deer to get meat, if you used a fireball to kill it instead you'd burn the meat and the meat would be worthless, I thought that was really neat.

I didn't know people in this game put even more of a premium on raw meat than I did. I mean, I eat raw meat because I'm unwilling to exert the extra effort for what I see as no real gain, not because I would openly refuse to eat it if it were slightly cooked. You're telling me this gameworld is SO fixated on RAW MEAT that there's NOBODY who would pay a premium for pre-cooked deer?

I think the idea is that the fireball is so hot it scorches the meat and burns it

[Norfleet]

I think the idea is that the fireball is so hot it scorches the meat and burns it

I find this hard to believe considering that I've eaten a pig that was napalmed. The inside layers were still fine! Hamtastic, even!

[anvi]

There are things I wish EQ did better that I forgot about until lately playing THJ.

I always felt like they could have re-use areas more, like having higher level content in low level areas etc. Have people return to the old zones again for other things. There are zones you would go to at level 1-5 ish and then never go back. There are also lots of great starting cities for each race, yet the other races never got to even see them.

It's nice to have new places to go if you make a new character, but it always bothered me that they are not making the most out of their assets. And there are places I would like to go back to but there's no reason to. The early expansions are much loved but even they bothered me because they just kept adding more and more new areas. It made the old areas ghost towns, yet they are often the best places.

High level players could go to the starter towns and kill the guards for xp so they kind of allowed what I wanted. But it was harder than it should have been, like they discouraged it. And I wanted to go inside the starter zone cities and kill all the royalty and stuff. It wasn't really possible becuase everything was so high level and strong. They didn't want newbies to have all their quest mobs and traders be dead, but they could have still let people fight other things.

There is an emulator server I played which did a better job. Like at any level you could randomly find Treasure Maps from enemies that have you dig in a random zone (even starter zones). Then waves of mobs spawn and you fight them. Solo, group, and raid versions. They also had better cities with more bonuses like rested XP and stuff. It encouraged people to go back to cities to restock and camp out.

[anvi]

If I was in charge of the game I would have done the expansion packs differently. Instead of them being whole new continents with new zones making the old game obsolete. I would redo the old zones and build the new content into it. And add a few new zones onto the old ones in suitable places.

I would have basically turned Trakanon's Teeth into Feerrott instead. Added that content into that zone and made it larger to accomodate it. Emerald Jungle I would probably just have shoved most of that into Rathe Mountains to make that less of a ghost town. I would have City of Mist and Field of Bone attached to Rathe Mts. This would drag Freeport/Neriak people over in that direction, instead of them basically going in a straight line through Oasis, Cazic, Upper Guk, L Guk, end. It would give them a diversion or at least an alternative progression.

Sebilis would obviously be added to the back of Lower Guk. Shards of Dalaya already did this but I would have thought of it too Firiona Vie wouldn't exist, all that should be in the goody starter cities. Then Dreadlands, Overthere, Karnor, Burning Woods, I'd have that all attached to East Karana, to Make The Karanas Great Again. (And also reward people for going that far). Karnor I would probably try to fit at the end of Gorge of King Xorbb (Beholder's Maze) because most people never went to that zone ever. Howling Stones I would have as a second zone to Unrest. I'd update Unrest to be bigger and more advanced pathing in the house. Bigger outdoor area more like Overthere scale. More varied mobs and mid level stuff added so the zone is never empty. Then in the house I'd have a boss in the upstairs on the balcony, then another boss on the top level. Kill both to get 2 components, then go to the basement and in the back where there's a pit I would move the newbie boots guy and add another higher level boss. Kill him and get 3rd component, combine and you can jump into the pit and enter Charasis.

All the quests and epics would be added in. The loft of Highkeep which has mysterious characters, sex slaves, corrupt guards, and a bank vault full of cash... is currently just a curiousity for adventurous soloers to find. But I'd have all that as part of the game. That vault would have a use for main quests.

Then the same with Velious. It's a huge frost continent with several new zones and lots of new content. But the original game already had a frost region that was hardly used. I would redo Everfrost Peaks to include Iceclad. Then I'd attach the other Velious zones to that. Some of it could be behind Vox.

And most importantly I would not have bonus xp and all the best gear in the new zones... I'd make it equal across the zones so people can go anywhere they like and know they are not being gimped. Add in some Prestige Classes to make people reroll, and the game never would have turned to crap.

[rusty_shackleford]

re: EQ, I have no idea why people seem to hate luclin so much. It's probably my favorite EQ expansion.

You get to be a cat and go to the moon! There's jungles on the moon!
How do people hate that??

[anvi]

Lol I like it too, more great dungeons. Although some zones are kinda bland. Like Umbral Planes could have used some love. I think some hate was probably because it was hard at first. Players became a bit lazy and then Luclin has mobs that can see invis, teleport behind you, drain your mana, etc.

The furry people are kinda gay though. But I like all the expansions really. I just would make them with an aim to preserve the integrity of the original game. Rather than just packaging new content for $30 a year or whatever and not caring about the rest.

[anvi]

I could play a cat but would prefer to be an actual cat. Or more like this:


Instead of this:

[rusty_shackleford]

Instead of this:

well you're supposed to pick the male