Hallmarks of bad modern game design

[rusty_shackleford]

I've noticed modern video games seem to be converging into a singular game thanks to ouroboros, and therefore every game now has the same terrible designs. So, why not make a list of them?

I'll start:

Ledges/walls that are clearly marked for you to jump/climb, typically using paint. For example, Dying Light 2:



Modern counterexample:
Conan Exiles lets you climb almost anything if you have the stamina to do it.

[General Reign]

I did not know Conan Exiles did that. I like that.

We have the obvious TOWER MARKERS that seem to plague every game that has some kind of open world. This might be one of those open world problems to be honest, meaning a lot of homogenized design seems to be filling in the gaps of open world texture swap games.

[rusty_shackleford]

I did not know Conan Exiles did that. I like that.

I had a surprising amount of fun with the game but the entire time I couldn't help but feel that the devs were forced to make it and a different game they wanted to make was struggling to get out from under that.

[wndrbr]

It all boils down to the graphics. Modern videogames have such busy and overly detailed visuals, it's hard to distinguish between actually interactable objects and environmental props that were put here for flavor. And this problem appeared as early as late 7th generation of consoles (Tomb Raider 2013 and Thief 2014 were among the first games where climb-able surfaces were marked with paint).

Videogame graphics should've stayed at late 6th gen / early 7th gen level. These days the overly high graphical fidelity balloons the budget and only makes games look uncanny.

[Vlajdimir Ermenović]

It all boils down to the graphics. Modern videogames have such busy and overly detailed visuals, it's hard to distinguish between actually interactable objects and environmental props that were put here for flavor. And this problem appeared as early as late 7th generation of consoles (Tomb Raider 2013 and Thief 2014 were among the first games where climb-able surfaces were marked with paint).

Videogame graphics should've stayed at late 6th gen / early 7th gen level.

Titanfall 2 could cut it without the paint markers. What's everyone else's excuse?

[rusty_shackleford]

It all boils down to the graphics. Modern videogames have such busy and overly detailed visuals, it's hard to distinguish between actually interactable objects and environmental props that were put here for flavor. And this problem appeared as early as late 7th generation of consoles (Tomb Raider 2013 and Thief 2014 were among the first games where climb-able surfaces were marked with paint).

Videogame graphics should've stayed at late 6th gen / early 7th gen level. These days the overly high graphical fidelity balloons the budget and only makes games look uncanny.

I disagree, I think the problem is that the game is designed like a themepark: you can only climb up those specific ledges therefore they must mark them. If you had free-form climbing you'd simply figure it out on your own by finding the ledges that get you to the point you need to be at.

[wndrbr]

It all boils down to the graphics. Modern videogames have such busy and overly detailed visuals, it's hard to distinguish between actually interactable objects and environmental props that were put here for flavor. And this problem appeared as early as late 7th generation of consoles (Tomb Raider 2013 and Thief 2014 were among the first games where climb-able surfaces were marked with paint).

Videogame graphics should've stayed at late 6th gen / early 7th gen level. These days the overly high graphical fidelity balloons the budget and only makes games look uncanny.

I disagree, I think the problem is that the game is designed like a themepark: you can only climb up those specific ledges therefore they must mark them. If you had free-form climbing you'd simply figure it out on your own by finding the ledges that get you to the point you need to be at.

that would require them to completely change their game design philosophy, which isn't going to happen. "You can climb here and only here" was a thing in AAA games for more than 20 years already - Sands of Time trilogy, the first Tomb Raider reboot, etc. The only reason devs started to mark climbable surfaces was them seeing the playtesters struggling to find where to go because that particular ledge didn't look climb-able enough.

[General Reign]

Just look at a game like Dwarf Fortress as one example of how games should be evolving. Maybe up the graphics out of the **** DOS era but something close to that. I would be happy with PS1 graphics if the game had complex systems to make up for it.

[Humbaba]

Dwarf Fortress isn't a game and actually lacks a lot despite the autistic amount of code within it.

[Fedora Master]

That haircut.

[Emphyrio]

crouch to sneak

[wndrbr]

crouch to sneak is a decent comprimise.

Devs prefer to use crouch stealth as opposed to sneaking while standing because it's easier for the player to read. You press the button, your character crouches, and it is clear that you're now in a 'stealth mode'. Immediate visual feedback.

[rusty_shackleford]

Crouch to sneak is a bad mechanic because it's a dumb mechanic. Nearly every stealth game is inherently stupid.

[maidenhaver]

Asassin's Creed turned grey when you blend into a crowd, or was that another game, but I like crouching more. Its easy to read, and a massive flex on guards, who skip leg day. If it was me, I'd telegraph you're in stealth mode by pulling down a hood or mask and change the walk anim. I never crouch in Thief, only run, bunny hop to rugs, and tip toe.

[maidenhaver]

Crouch to sneak is a bad mechanic because it's a dumb mechanic. Nearly every stealth game is inherently stupid.

Inherently how?

[Segata]

Inherently how?

The way devs use it is unrealistic and stupid. Crouching's main aim should be to hide line of sight by using the environment, but in video games devs use it as a super silent mode that renders your footsteps inaudible, or to reduce visibility despite your character not being concealed by the environment.

[maidenhaver]

Inherently how?

The way devs use it is unrealistic and stupid. Crouching's main aim should be to hide line of sight by using the environment, but in video games devs use it as a super silent mode that renders your footsteps inaudible, or to reduce visibility despite your character not being concealed by the environment.

Yeah, but that makes the game inherently stupid?

[Segata]

Yeah, but that makes the game inherently stupid?

Talking about the crouching mechanic only, not the genre being inherently stupid. I like good stealth games but we'll never get a good one in the age of accessibility.

[rusty_shackleford]

Inherently how?

The way devs use it is unrealistic and stupid. Crouching's main aim should be to hide line of sight by using the environment, but in video games devs use it as a super silent mode that renders your footsteps inaudible, or to reduce visibility despite your character not being concealed by the environment.

Yeah, but that makes the game inherently stupid?

Yes, because it's a mechanic that is essentially arcade-tier. Same deal with enemies that just patrol back and forth for no reason.
It's fine if your game has no story or worldbuilding and is just some arcade game, it becomes ridiculous when you're something like ******* MGS5.

[maidenhaver]

So you want guards to randomly walk up stairs Y instead of use the elevator again, play mobile games in their guard shack, sit in the kitchen eating snacks, etc? Security jobs entail walking in circles and sitting in one place when that gets dull.

[maidenhaver]

Modern stealth wouldn't work as an interesting mechanic, because I can literally walk past somebody watching tik toks and they won't know it. We live in a stealth game.

[Norfleet]

Ledges/walls that are clearly marked for you to jump/climb, typically using paint. For example, Dying Light 2:

The marking of interactables in some way as distinct from non-interactable graphical clutter is sort of a necessity with modern graphics that are filled with noise. How else does one know that you are supposed to GET YE FLASK, and not the other 15 otherwise identical-looking flasks sitting nearby to make area look more "workshoppy"? How do you know that THIS air vent is the one you're supposed to open and fart into, and not the 15 other identical air vents that should have been equally valid but are really just bumpy textures painted onto the wall and not actual vents? That's why **** needs to be glowy or otherwise marked now.

Conan Exiles lets you climb almost anything if you have the stamina to do it.

See, that'd be the alternative way of doing it: That things don't need to be marked for this functionality because there is no clutter: Everything you see is valid. Obviously, this entails a hell of a lot more work if suddenly every ledge is climbable, because what if the devs don't want you to actually climb here, but they still want to visually have a ledgy-thing there because it looks like there should be? Thus, the glowy ledges vs. the non-glowy ledges.

Modern stealth wouldn't work as an interesting mechanic, because I can literally walk past somebody watching tik toks and they won't know it. We live in a stealth game.

Often you can just do it in plain sight while they're looking right at you, make eye contact with them, nod acknowledgingly, and just keep walking right through like you're supposed to be doing that, and they won't react or otherwise try to stop you.

[Humbaba]

Let's just sum all of this up as "stealth mechanics" of any kind. I liked MGSV though.

[maidenhaver]

Often you can just do it in plain sight while they're looking right at you, make eye contact with them, nod acknowledgingly, and just keep walking right through like you're supposed to be doing that, and they won't react or otherwise try to stop you.

Very true, and so the best disguise is confidence and swagger.

[Segata]

How else does one know that you are supposed to GET YE FLASK, and not the other 15 otherwise identical-looking flasks sitting nearby to make area look more "workshoppy"?

I would just tell this to video game devs:

► Show Spoiler

[maidenhaver]

rusty's favorite stealth game sounds like it would be Thief, the reboot. The stealth is pressing a button to zip between shadows, because crouching is stupid.

[KnightoftheWind]

It all boils down to the graphics. Modern videogames have such busy and overly detailed visuals, it's hard to distinguish between actually interactable objects and environmental props that were put here for flavor. And this problem appeared as early as late 7th generation of consoles (Tomb Raider 2013 and Thief 2014 were among the first games where climb-able surfaces were marked with paint).

Videogame graphics should've stayed at late 6th gen / early 7th gen level. These days the overly high graphical fidelity balloons the budget and only makes games look uncanny.

Exactly. Realistic graphics just make games worse, all around. Even if you don't discuss all the band-aids developers have to do just to design a playable area, there was always a sense of mystery and wonder that you get in things that are "worse". Low res textures, low poly models, fuzzier sound, sprites etc. Your mind tends to fill in the blanks, and you are more immersed as a result. Now?, all the rough edges are sanded away and everything is too **** boring. There is beauty in imperfection, we know this but we seldom admit it.

Now I'm not a Silent Hill fan, but the upcoming remake of Silent Hill 2 will be a worse experience than the original. Not because the game itself will suck, maybe it will maybe it won't, but it won't convey the same sense of dread in it's more realistic visuals. Something will be lost in the transition, and I think many will end up going back to the PS2 version or the fan-made Enhanced version on PC.

[rusty_shackleford]

There is nothing in that elevator shaft that is any more difficult to make out than the elevator shaft in VTMB's mansion level, yet that didn't require painting specific areas with yellow.

[KnightoftheWind]

There is nothing in that elevator shaft that is any more difficult to make out than the elevator shaft in VTMB's mansion level, yet that didn't require painting specific areas with yellow.

You have to realize that developers have ways of emphasizing where you need to go. They either design levels in a linear fashion, for example stairs that lead up to the next area or a door that ends the level, or they guide you along through less obvious visual cues. Maybe a series of streetlamps will lead you to where you need to go, or there are landmarks in the distance that you identify with.

Modern games, because they are so visually complex, have to rely on very obvious and very clear cues to guide you. Because imagine for a minute if that yellow paint wasn't there, how exactly would you tell it apart from other surfaces that you can't climb on or walk over or interact with?. You probably couldn't, because every object is shaded the same way and the same clutter is everywhere. What's actually important to you as the player is obscured in a cloud of RTX On ,Chromatic Abberration, SSAO, PBR, 8K textures, and all that.

[rusty_shackleford]

You have to realize that developers have ways of emphasizing where you need to go. They either design levels in a linear fashion, for example stairs that lead up to the next area or a door that ends the level

Elevator shafts are pretty linear...