Various role-playing RPG game stuff not deserving its own thread

[rusty_shackleford]

Gothic 1 has a large amount of black people
Gothic 2 is nearly all white

[UltraFan123]

I think a relatively good example of "class-less" system that still uses levels and skill point buy is Tyranny.

Your protagonist the Fatebinder has the potential to either specialize into a particular combat style or just act as a "commander" that relies on others, and your companions are built in a way that they will always outshine the Fatebinder in their own particular niches.

[rusty_shackleford]

Been chewing on this bone for a bit since I've played a lot of point-buy party-based RPGs lately.

Major issue with classless point-buy('skill based') party-based RPGs is you rarely ever have a good reason to be good at combat on your character when you can just compensate using companions. This is usually compounded heavily by having certain skills only useful on the main character, whereas other skills are useful on anyone.
I suspect this could be ameliorated with typed point-buy like in age of decadence which has a split for civil & combat skills, divinity original sin did this too, probably other RPGs.

Class-based games tend to have much more well-rounded characters unless you're forcing yourself to play suboptimally in point-buy.

Daggerfall had a really good system if you exclude custom classes. Well, not necessarily exclude, but restrict. It's obvious custom classes breaks the game, a big part of classes is — depending on your point of view, being forced or getting for free things you otherwise wouldn't take to create a more grounded, well-rounded adventurer.


Games like WL3, full party creation, you're going to have a 'face' character anyways. But in games where you have a de facto main character that is your avatar, you're really pigeonholed into a handful of archetypes at best by design. I don't like this.

Daggerfall almost requires you to wear all those hats or suffer for it. How long are you willing to put up with trying to find your way out of a dungeon without being able to mark or recall?

I tend to let design issues in older titles get a pass because it was still very early, there are design issues now that are even worse despite not even being experimental, however.

[Tangerine]

Gothic 1 has a large amount of black people
Gothic 2 is nearly all white

Don't you start Gothic 1 in a prison? Why wouldn't you see lots of *******?

[rusty_shackleford]

Gothic either lacks or has weak 'traditional' RPG elements but ends up being a better RPG almost entirely due to world simulation aspects, along with just having a very well designed gameworld to explore. Really understated how important that kind of stuff is. It could have easily fallen into 'action game with RPG elements' if it didn't have such a good world simulation. Which is what a lot of PB's weaker titles are.
@WhiteShark

[Val the Moofia Boss]

@Cmdr Shepard how far into GBF Relink are you? Any thoughts? Thinks you like? Dislike?

[Finarfin]

@Cmdr Shepard how far into GBF Relink are you? Any thoughts? Thinks you like? Dislike?

Not far I'm afraid. Maybe got to the point where I save some villagers from goblins/orcs. Will play more tomorrow. I like the game so far. I'm assuming the armor won't change looks-wise. which is fine I guess (I could get some of the dlc costumes later on unledd you unlock stuff by just playing) No dislikes so far. I like the fact that I can level/learn everything in the masteries without sacrificing the other choices in the tree

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I'm assuming the armor won't change looks-wise. which is fine I guess

Gran gets a suit of armor a little further into the game, and you can toggle Siegfried's helmet and mask, but otherwise that's it.

[rusty_shackleford]

Is GBF one of those gacha games?

[WhiteShark]

Is GBF one of those gacha games?

Granblue Fantasy is, but they're talking about a spin-off action RPG called Granblue Fantasy: Relink. I actually pirated it to try it a couple months ago, and it seems fun, but I wouldn't be able to play with @Val the Moofia Boss and co without a legitimate copy.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Is GBF one of those gacha games?

Relink is this game

[Finarfin]

I'm assuming the armor won't change looks-wise. which is fine I guess

Gran gets a suit of armor a little further into the game, and you can toggle Siegfried's helmet and mask, but otherwise that's it.

guess I'll get that evil costume pack then.

[rusty_shackleford]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

The origins of BoS is Wasteland, not Fallout, btw. https://wasteland-archive.fandom.com/wi ... _Old_Order
Unlike a lot of other adaptations, they were lifted 1:1 with a name change.

[TKVNC]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

The origins of BoS is Wasteland, not Fallout, btw. https://wasteland-archive.fandom.com/wi ... _Old_Order
Unlike a lot of other adaptations, they were lifted 1:1 with a name change.

What annoys me about the BoS is people (in game as well) saying they are facists / racists etc. for being Human supremacists - in an apocalypse, lmao

[rusty_shackleford]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

The origins of BoS is Wasteland, not Fallout, btw. https://wasteland-archive.fandom.com/wi ... _Old_Order
Unlike a lot of other adaptations, they were lifted 1:1 with a name change.

What annoys me about the BoS is people (in game as well) saying they are facists / racists etc. for being Human supremacists - in an apocalypse, lmao

You're referring to the enclave I think?

[TKVNC]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

The origins of BoS is Wasteland, not Fallout, btw. https://wasteland-archive.fandom.com/wi ... _Old_Order
Unlike a lot of other adaptations, they were lifted 1:1 with a name change.

What annoys me about the BoS is people (in game as well) saying they are facists / racists etc. for being Human supremacists - in an apocalypse, lmao

You're referring to the enclave I think?

Nah, BoS in FO4, even members of the BoS say dumb **** like this.

It's entirely incongruous with the theme, the setting, and the faction.

*added some more clarification

[rusty_shackleford]

Bethesda BoS retcons actually ended up going full circle back to Wasteland btw. The rangers in Wasteland were created from a engineers division of the military (on mobile so I won't go look it up), Bethesda changed it so that BoS was as well. I don't know if this was intended or accidental. It also causes overlap between enclave & BoS.

[rusty_shackleford]

And since I'm on the topic, I strongly disagree with a lot of Tim Cain's claims that "fallout was always woke", @Roguey
He didn't write or design much of the original Fallouts, Scott Campbell did. Even if we take both of the games together, Campbell probably did more than any other single person. He's obviously trying to reinterpret his past thru his fudge packed tinted lenses.
He can discuss the original ideas of Fallout, but he's obviously claiming **** that isn't true. Yeah, the ultra woke game where you convince a wife to **** you so you'll help her husband, play as a female and get drugged then raped, then go lose an arm wrestling match and get raped up the *** by a super mutant.

Being shocking and offensive just to be shocking and offensive is the opposite of 'woke'. It wasn't pushing any agenda except perhaps **** censors. They lost the GURPS license because it was too violent, Tim Cain aligns 100% with SJ(w) games now.

[TKVNC]

And since I'm on the topic, I strongly disagree with a lot of Tim Cain's claims that "fallout was always woke", @Roguey
He didn't write or design much of the original Fallouts, Scott Campbell did. If we take both of the games together, Campbell probably did more than any other single person. He's obviously trying to reinterpret his past thru his fudge packed tinted lenses.
He can discuss the original ideas of Fallout, but he's obviously claiming **** that isn't true. Yeah, the ultra woke game where you convince a wife to **** you so you'll help her husband, play as a female.and get drugged then raped, then go lose an arm wrestling match and get raped up the *** by a super mutant.

Being shocking and offensive just to be shocking and offensive is the opposite of 'woke'. It wasn't go pushing any agenda except perhaps **** censors.

******** retconning is a staple of leftist 'developers'

[logincrash]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

That's because Bethesda's Fallout is a ******'s understanding of what Fallout was about, a frozen in time wasteland with a shallow "1950s futuristic but post-apocalyptic world" coat of paint.
And the New Vegas Brotherhood IS a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. Because that's what happens in a post-post-apocalyptic world. They'd rather slowly die out than change. Which is also why the huge "we're Lawful Good Paladins out to help the common folk" sect of the Brotherhood is an impossibility in the proper setting. It only happened in Bethesda's Fallout theme park attractions (i.e. their Fallout games).

[rusty_shackleford]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

That's because Bethesda's Fallout is a ******'s understanding of what Fallout was about, a frozen in time wasteland with a shallow "1950s futuristic but post-apocalyptic world" coat of paint.
And the New Vegas Brotherhood IS a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. Because that's what happens in a post-post-apocalyptic world. They'd rather slowly die out than change. Which is also why the huge "we're Lawful Good Paladins out to help the common folk" sect of the Brotherhood is an impossibility in the proper setting. It only happened in Bethesda's Fallout theme park attractions (i.e. their Fallout games).

I see the break off sect as completely compatible with FNV tho. I'm not saying they'd all go this way, but certainly at least a portion of them would realize the times have changed and they need to rethink their ideals.
Having two competing BoS factions might have been neat, actually.

[logincrash]

I actually prefer Bethesda's interpretation of the Brotherhood of Steel as it moves the plot along. BoS was created for a post apocalyptic society, not a post post apocalyptic society.

By the time of e.g., new Vegas they feel like a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. It makes sense that the organization would begin to reform.

That's because Bethesda's Fallout is a ******'s understanding of what Fallout was about, a frozen in time wasteland with a shallow "1950s futuristic but post-apocalyptic world" coat of paint.
And the New Vegas Brotherhood IS a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. Because that's what happens in a post-post-apocalyptic world. They'd rather slowly die out than change. Which is also why the huge "we're Lawful Good Paladins out to help the common folk" sect of the Brotherhood is an impossibility in the proper setting. It only happened in Bethesda's Fallout theme park attractions (i.e. their Fallout games).

I see the break off sect as completely compatible with FNV tho. I'm not saying they'd all go this way, but certainly at least a portion of them would realize the times have changed and they need to rethink their ideals.
Having two competing BoS factions might have been neat, actually.

Sure, it would've been had the writers intended to have that conflict and did something with it. If they made the Lyons' heroic faction the Outcasts and the the original isolationist Brotherhood remained the Brotherhood instead of being the Outcasts for some ******* reason. As it is now, it's all backwards and ******** and shows that Bethesda doesn't understand the Fallout setting beyond "ooh, this looks cool and that looks cool."

[DagothGeas5]

That's because Bethesda's Fallout is a ******'s understanding of what Fallout was about, a frozen in time wasteland with a shallow "1950s futuristic but post-apocalyptic world" coat of paint.
And the New Vegas Brotherhood IS a complete remnant of something that shouldn't exist and is dying. Because that's what happens in a post-post-apocalyptic world. They'd rather slowly die out than change. Which is also why the huge "we're Lawful Good Paladins out to help the common folk" sect of the Brotherhood is an impossibility in the proper setting. It only happened in Bethesda's Fallout theme park attractions (i.e. their Fallout games).

I see the break off sect as completely compatible with FNV tho. I'm not saying they'd all go this way, but certainly at least a portion of them would realize the times have changed and they need to rethink their ideals.
Having two competing BoS factions might have been neat, actually.

Sure, it would've been had the writers intended to have that conflict and did something with it. If they made the Lyons' heroic faction the Outcasts and the the original isolationist Brotherhood remained the Brotherhood instead of being the Outcasts for some ******* reason. As it is now, it's all backwards and ******** and shows that Bethesda doesn't understand the Fallout setting beyond "ooh, this looks cool and that looks cool."

That is very strange what they did. Even with "modern media", for example Bioware, everyone of the "real Bioware", so to speak, left and what remains just keeps the name but is nothing like the original thing, why would they make it work differently here?
Edit as I might word it better, the foundation of the organization is the one that keeps the name no matter what, even if it's different. Like you said, there is no logic in the foundation changing a name, to something like "outcasts" no less.

[Roguey]

Yeah, the ultra woke game where you convince a wife to **** you so you'll help her husband, play as a female and get drugged then raped, then go lose an arm wrestling match and get raped up the *** by a super mutant.

These are all examples from Fallout 2 which also has a Dan Quayle they make fun of at the end.

[rusty_shackleford]

Yeah, the ultra woke game where you convince a wife to **** you so you'll help her husband, play as a female and get drugged then raped, then go lose an arm wrestling match and get raped up the *** by a super mutant.

These are all examples from Fallout 2 which also has a Dan Quayle they make fun of at the end.

dan quayle was already old when fallout 2 was made, avellone has stated it was some aging boomer that added it iirc
it would be like making a game now and adding political commentary about george bush

[Roguey]

dan quayle was already old when fallout 2 was made, avellone has stated it was some aging boomer that added it iirc
it would be like making a game now and adding political commentary about george bush

Matt Norton, the lead designer was responsible for it https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Matt_Norton. Avellone hated all his ideas.

He wasn't that old either https://archive.ph/QQF9

I recall looking at his social media not too long ago and it was full of libtardation, but I'm either misremembering it or he purged it.

[Ickthys]

Dragon Ruins 2, next year. I put a few hours in the first, before I got bored. Maybe this one will be fun.

[Hyborian]

AFK is such a ******.

Yeah, the guy tweets out his moronic thoughts way too much. The fact that he's extremely obnoxious makes it all the worse. Journos love to make clickbait articles out of his **** tweets. I wonder why they never quote that ****** fiddlecub.

[Hyborian]

Should have linked the tweet instead of a screencap, useless ******.

[Tweed]

Dragon Ruins 2, next year. I put a few hours in the first, before I got bored. Maybe this one will be fun.

ZZ is chasing the JMTDATMBO money.