What's your opinion on quest logs?

[rusty_shackleford]

Should the game automatically log quests for you, or should it expect the player to be taking notes?

Are there any RPGs that allow for 'assisted' note taking? e.g., being able to take notes at any point in time, and associating it with your location, NPC you're talking to, or just adding pre-defined 'tags' such as keywords mentioned, NPCs known, items, etc.,?

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

Should the game automatically log quests for you, or should it expect the player to be taking notes?

Are there any RPGs that allow for 'assisted' note taking? e.g., being able to take notes at any point in time, and associating it with your location, NPC you're talking to, or just adding 'tags'?

It really depends. But I prefer the quest log just to update since I can a thing of multiple ways of it being very frustrating having to take notes if not properly handled in the core design.

[Magick]

Taking notes is good if it's probably built in and suits the style of the game (more oldschool style).
Otherwise quest log is fine. An adventurer would absolutely be noting down what they need to do for whom.

What I dislike though (other than MMOs) are the icons / UI indicators (unless it's for something I added myself). The game may as well play itself for me..
I should have to decipher where to go and what to do from the quest text and conversations,

[rusty_shackleford]

Otherwise quest log is fine. An adventurer would absolutely be noting down what they need to do for whom.

Adventurers do combat too, but I don't see that as a reason to skip combat.

[rusty_shackleford]

Having skills related to taking notes well would be interesting, at least. I think in Arcanum(?), if your character is low int the journal is in grug english.

[Oyster Sauce]

I don't want to write down the specifics for every quest in every game ever made. Just let me add symbols and notes to a map.

[rusty_shackleford]

I don't want to write down the specifics for every quest in every game ever made. Just let me add symbols and notes to a map.

Fair. Would be cool to manually add information to a basic outline your characters adds, perhaps which is based upon some combination of attributes & skills of your character.

For example, this is the FO2 quest log:



Being able to manually add notes or 'tag' things related to each entry, or having a more astute character improve his note taking beyond the bare basics, would be neat. I can think of a lot of ways this could be improved (e.g., did I get hints as to where Smiley is? Anything I should know about him? Is the area dangerous? Who do I report to afterwards? etc.,)


'Fix K9' is also very vague, for example. But it's just enough to have the general gist.

[DagothGeas5]

I myself never use the quest log because I can recall what was said or, if I don't, I hope there are consequences down the line to it that I can roleplay into the narrative. Quest logs like MMOs do feel at times more like a checklist, and though some are fun for me to go through and complete them all, it tends to take things out of the experience for me.
Used to take notes when I played Morrowind just for fun, but had to stop because I noticed the game had it incorporated and it was easier to click on a name and see the reference, or what other NPCs said about said topic, without having to continually sift through pages that can't exactly be neatly updated with new information.

[Oyster Sauce]

RDR2 has a very nicely done in-character journal where you takes note and makes sketches as you discover things throughout the game.

► Show Spoiler

The characters have noticeably different artstyles and literacy levels.

[rusty_shackleford]

Used to take notes when I played Morrowind just for fun, but had to stop because I noticed the game had it incorporated and it was easier to click on a name and see the reference, or what other NPCs said about said topic, without having to continually sift through pages that can't exactly be neatly updated with new information.

This is more towards what I was referring to with 'tags', having an ingame note system that lets you link to an NPC, location, or item would be neat.

[DagothGeas5]

Used to take notes when I played Morrowind just for fun, but had to stop because I noticed the game had it incorporated and it was easier to click on a name and see the reference, or what other NPCs said about said topic, without having to continually sift through pages that can't exactly be neatly updated with new information.

This is more towards what I was referring to with 'tags', having an ingame note system that lets you link to an NPC, location, or item would be neat.

Thinking about it I believe Black Desert Online has such a system as well, though I am not 100% sure.

As for usermade quest logs, Icewind Dale (and the second game as well I believe) have also that same user-made quest log and note thing. Just from this I am guessing Baldur's Gate might have also.

[Nemesis]

Let the game update the quest log; it's one less thing the player has to worry about.

[maidenhaver]

Yes, if the game is small, and the point is to slow the player down to pay attention and take his time.

[Acrux]

There are only two quests that need attention in any game:

Get to the bottom level
Kill the boss

[WhiteShark]

Ideally, I think quests in the modern explicit sense wouldn't exist. No quest log, no checkboxes, no XP for completing them. Instead there would be information and requests, which one would have to track himself, and those could be pursued to their natural outcomes: loot, rewards, and favors. The game would provide a journal and a map, and the player would be in charge of maintaining both. All of this is part of the intellectual side of RPGs, which is really supposed to be the domain of the player.

[Tweed]

They're fine and games that try to make you take manual notes to bring back that "old school" feel are just being stupid posers. Nobody misses that crap. I dare you to play The Magic Candle without a guide, take your own notes and tell me you still want to play your games that way.

[somerandomdude]

Just because there's a button to open up the quest log, doesn't mean you have to use it? Nothing is stopping someone from taking manual notes if that's how they want to play the game.

[WhiteShark]

Just because there's a button to open up the quest log, doesn't mean you have to use it? Nothing is stopping someone from taking manual notes if that's how they want to play the game.

Putting a useful tool in front of the player intimates to him two things: that the developer made the game with that tool in mind, and that it's therefore licit for him to use it. This isn't a question of self-restraint, but of design.

[somerandomdude]

Putting a useful tool in front of the player intimates to him two things: that the developer made the game with that tool in mind, and that it's therefore licit for him to use it. This isn't a question of self-restraint, but of design.

Something like a quest log is a QOL feature, which games require you to open up the quest log in order to complete a quest? It's almost always a matter of self-restraint.

[WhiteShark]

Putting a useful tool in front of the player intimates to him two things: that the developer made the game with that tool in mind, and that it's therefore licit for him to use it. This isn't a question of self-restraint, but of design.

Something like a quest log is a QOL feature, which games require you to open up the quest log in order to complete a quest? It's almost always a matter of self-restraint.

You're missing the point. Many games don't give clear information in-world because the developer can just dump it all in the journal and on the minimap. They do that because they give the player those tools and expect the player to use them.

[Daxa]

Are there any RPGs that allow for 'assisted' note taking? e

I don't remeber any recent RPG with notetaking, but I know Skyrim has a mod just for that, and it works great

About questlogs in general, it's okay, i guess. I normally play RPGs and games in general in bursts, where I'll play the same game for 3 days straight and then not play anything for a while and come back. Some times I remember everything I was doing in the game, other times I load the save and look at everything like "the **** I was doing again." So questlogs help me a bit on that...even though in the end I just end up making a new save anyway. 

[somerandomdude]

You're missing the point. Many games don't give clear information in-world because the developer can just dump it all in the journal and on the minimap. They do that because they give the player those tools and expect the player to use them.

There's usually dialogue hints accompanying the logs and markers. "There's a cave to the south-west of here full of goblins that needs to be cleared out", etc. Even if the game gives you the option for instant gratification with a quest marker, you could always just explore and find it without these tools - this is one of the reasons why people ask for options to disable quest markers in games, and that's a fair request.

[rusty_shackleford]

We have games that have mods to disable quest markers. The quests become nearly impossible to complete because you don't have anywhere near enough information. There's a skyrim mod that rewrites a ton of quests specifically because of this issue.

[rusty_shackleford]

Putting a useful tool in front of the player intimates to him two things: that the developer made the game with that tool in mind, and that it's therefore licit for him to use it. This isn't a question of self-restraint, but of design.

Something like a quest log is a QOL feature, which games require you to open up the quest log in order to complete a quest? It's almost always a matter of self-restraint.

"OK so the game is designed around you using an invincibility cheat, but you could just get some self-restraint and not use it???"

[rusty_shackleford]

They're fine and games that try to make you take manual notes to bring back that "old school" feel are just being stupid posers. Nobody misses that crap. I dare you to play The Magic Candle without a guide, take your own notes and tell me you still want to play your games that way.

This circles back around to my point of Fallout 'quest logs' being an ideal, imo. They're spartan and give just enough information to know what to do. Add some improvements/utilities to take better notes, and/or combined with automatically adding improved notes based on character's ability.

[somerandomdude]

"OK so the game is designed around you using an invincibility cheat, but you could just get some self-restraint and not use it???"

Quest markers for lazy gamers are = to invincibility cheats, got it.

[rusty_shackleford]

"OK so the game is designed around you using an invincibility cheat, but you could just get some self-restraint and not use it???"

Quest markers for lazy gamers are = to invincibility cheats, got it.

It's pretty much the same in that the hypothetical game was designed around using them, just like games with quest markers are, yeah.

[somerandomdude]

We have games that have mods to disable quest markers. The quests become nearly impossible to complete because you don't have anywhere near enough information. There's a skyrim mod that rewrites a ton of quests specifically because of this issue.

This sounds like cope to me.

[Dorateen]

Notebook and pen, all the way. And this was a game in a series that started streamlining by including a quest log. I still took down manual notes.

[Nemesis]

Nice. If people have notes from previous RPG runs, post them here.