All modders are parasitic losers?

[Vaako]

Just because a single person doesnt build a skyscraper by himself, doesnt mean he cant build something for his apartment to look nicer.

[Decline]

If you make yet another STALKER full conversion mod with the SDK you got you've passed the decline horizon. If you mod in yet another AK-47 with a Hello Kitty paintjob you're probably in the clear?

That's ********.

I don't disagree.

even if they're financially stable and do what they do because they actually enjoy doing it? not everything needs to be motivated be monetary gain.

Again, after a certain point - the decline horizon - it becomes impossible to throw more time & resources at modding unless either being paid (in other words, you develop your own game) or you become terminally insane.
This rule isn't true to just modding as we established earlier but also extends to most all activities including but not limited to the ricing of cars and the administration of internet bullet boards about computer role playing games.

Eh, many games and even entire genres wouldn't exist without mods.

But that is precisely the point: They did not cross the decline horizon and decided to stop being lazy parasites. (Obviously often the people that start a mod and those that turn it into a game are not the same people but let's not make this apparently complex argument even more difficult.)

Ash (Who goes by some other name on modding sites) is the original creator along with the creator of several other mods and is also a confrontational ********. I'd rather have him here posting than Decline any day of the week.

I am glad that it is the other way around. We've got enough confrontational dickheads doing nothing of value here already. At least the 'Nazi filter' seems to work in our favor by keeping out the worst among the modders... for now. But I am sure our competent administration already has got a contingency plan in place for when the masses inevitably come trying to jump the border...i digress, i digress.

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

But I am sure our competent administration already has got a contingency plan in place for when the masses inevitably come trying to jump the border

I find that possibility extremely unlikely.

[Statesman]

how jewish it is to call modders "parasitic losers" because they decided to forego making money off their talents

The irony is not lost on me that equating 'having an outcome with your profession so as to not live parasitically off the society that supports you' with 'being jewish' thus devaluating all prof. dev work is the epitome of a brain full of jewish thought.

But do go on. You are making one thing very clear:

Modifying your original argument and then going "N-no you are the jew" doesn't really help your case, but I'll bite and take your newly-stated line of thought into account. Your original statement was:

I made the argument that modders are parasitic losers, that because of inherent inability and/or lazyness cannot create real games and cannot make money off of their supposed talent, and are therefore bound to a parasitic existence of leeching off of competent peoples' ideas while wasting everyone's time with terrible code and ****** ideas, which in turn reflects back on the modders becoming increasingly more intolerable to society around them with each passing day.

Most modders already have a profession and mod on their spare time. So calling them "parasitic losers" for not making money out of their hobby is indeed jewish to me. Can you expand on how modding devalues developer work though?

[Red7]

i honestly dont have much respect to anyone who is not engineer/builder or mechanical designer of any sort. (or u are but u design gay **** alike apple products) u might as well be pointless vagina

mans life purpose is to design and build better weaponry to protect empire from aliens


btw almost all ppl are parasitic losers as their jobs are fake and they cant build or desing anything mechanical
its why **** made communism to farm goy cattle and harvest suffering of their failed lives to feed ultraterrestrial entity

[Nessa]

Everyone is a parasitic loser. Earth needs to be glassed.

I like how this discussion has progressed.

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

i honestly dont have much respect to anyone who is not engineer/builder or mechanical designer of any sort. (or u are but u design gay **** alike apple products) u might as well be pointless vagina

mans life purpose is to design and build better weaponry to protect empire from aliens

Life is more meaningful then producing weapons of war.

btw almost all ppl are parasitic losers as their jobs are fake and they cant build or desing anything mechanical

Every job is important to someone in the end of the day.

[Red7]

i honestly dont have much respect to anyone who is not engineer/builder or mechanical designer of any sort. (or u are but u design gay **** alike apple products) u might as well be pointless vagina

mans life purpose is to design and build better weaponry to protect empire from aliens

Life is more meaningful then producing weapons of war.

sounds gay

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

i honestly dont have much respect to anyone who is not engineer/builder or mechanical designer of any sort. (or u are but u design gay **** alike apple products) u might as well be pointless vagina

mans life purpose is to design and build better weaponry to protect empire from aliens

Life is more meaningful then producing weapons of war.

sounds gay

We all find meaning in different ways while living life gay or not.

[Red7]

Life is more meaningful then producing weapons of war.

sounds gay

We all find meaning in different ways while living life gay or not.

i actually figured out meaning of cosmos years ago during researching digital physics

[Decline]

Modifying your original argument

I did not modify my argument at all, you are just too stupid to comprehend it.
Honestly, I would like you to stay out of my thread because you simply cannot keep up. A perfect example:

Most modders already have a profession and mod on their spare time.

How can they do 'total overhauls' and other superfluous things in their spare time while being a productive member of society and working a 40h week?
You are either too young or too stupid or most likely both to understand that money is materialized energy.

[Zothique]

Life is more meaningful then producing weapons of war.

sounds gay

We all find meaning in different ways while living life gay or not.

I have a feeling you are either a woman or gay.

[DDC]

It's been a long time since I've been very involved in the mod scene, but when I was I generally saw the modders as selfless people who were giving up their time for the public good far out of proportion to any benefit they would derive from it. Just some random things I can think of over the years that I've greatly enjoyed:

-numerous translation patches for jrpgs that never got a release in the US
-porting levels from the old 3D sonic games into the sonic generations engine with improved graphics
-adding reasonably good VR support to games that were never intended to have it
-hacked software to play games from the Oculus store on better, non-oculus headsets, and to use the Valve index controllers (which are the best) with different headsets
-numerous HD texture replacers
-countless morrowind and oblivion mods. I would play with 150+ and the world felt so much more interesting and alive. There were also some total overhauls that fixed bad design decisions such as having enemies level with the player, replacing the whole world with static level enemies and a lot more unique enemies and NPCs.

Maybe many of the people who did those things were "losers," but I don't see how they could be called "parasitic" in any way. Now, I'm sure the scene has changed some, and everything I read in passing about the people who run the most popular mod sites indicates that they are insufferable, ******-loving tyrants. But it's not fair to lump all modders together, because some are out there doing greatly beneficial work for free. And the obnoxious ones could probably be said to be mirroring the trajectory of game developers as a whole.

[BannedForBeingSane]

Recently we had an argument going in the chat.

The argument started when discussing the merits of MedianXL, or rather lack of it, a ****** mod to an even worse game, doesn't matter here, and the inevitability of the modder behind it being a psychopathic *******.

I made the argument that modders are parasitic losers, that because of inherent inability and/or lazyness cannot create real games and cannot make money off of their supposed talent, and are therefore bound to a parasitic existence of leeching off of competent peoples' ideas while wasting everyone's time with terrible code and ****** ideas, which in turn reflects back on the modders becoming increasingly more intolerable to society around them with each passing day.

Naturally our resident eastern europeon @Tweed immediately felt found out and told me to basically suck a bag of dicks, probably under the impression that lame insults will prevent people from noticing that his people have been the modders of europe all along. Or maybe he is just fiercely territorial.

After single-handedly obliterating the entirety of eastern europeons existence for the past 1000 years, I felt comfortable enough to take ****. The oval office is a man's place of ideas as they say and while relieving myself I began to ponder: Are all modders pathetic losers? Surely, some mods appear to be okay. For example if someone has a great idea for a new trinket and fires up blender or whatever to realize the virtual item of his dreams in his favorite game and then also goes through the hassle of sharing this work with like-minded nerds and the rest of the world, he or she cannot be a bad person? Or take the dewoking efforts for BG3 by @orinEsque et al. Is she a bad person, beyond being a woman and brown? No, obviously not because the mods are required for a tolerable experience of that game.

This lead me to realize that some modding appears to be okay, basically, and doesn't make you a loser. But it also cannot be denied that most modders are insufferable *******. So logically there ought to be a threshold of modding beyond which you inevitably turn from a normal person into an eastern europeon. I call this the decline horizon. But can this decline horizon then be quantified? And of course that is where things get hairy.

So, I would argue that as long as you mod QoL changes into a game, like fixing bugs, making trinkets, enlarge boobs and whatever else passes for quality in that particular game's life you have not passed the decline horizon. If however you start 'total overhauls' and other such worthless shenanigans where it would really be better for you and the world around you that you do your own goddamn game you are crossing the decline horizon and hurling towards your inevitable doom.

No idea is complete however without exposing it to the shrieking of the uneducated masses scrutiny of esteemed colleagues. So, what is your opinion: does the decline horizon exist or are all modders parasitic losers? And if it exists where would you draw it?

Thanks for your consideration.

Modding is a tool. And like all tools, what matters is who wields it.

[maidenhaver]

Recently we had an argument going in the chat.

The argument started when discussing the merits of MedianXL, or rather lack of it, a ****** mod to an even worse game, doesn't matter here, and the inevitability of the modder behind it being a psychopathic *******.

I made the argument that modders are parasitic losers, that because of inherent inability and/or lazyness cannot create real games and cannot make money off of their supposed talent, and are therefore bound to a parasitic existence of leeching off of competent peoples' ideas while wasting everyone's time with terrible code and ****** ideas, which in turn reflects back on the modders becoming increasingly more intolerable to society around them with each passing day.

Naturally our resident eastern europeon @Tweed immediately felt found out and told me to basically suck a bag of dicks, probably under the impression that lame insults will prevent people from noticing that his people have been the modders of europe all along. Or maybe he is just fiercely territorial.

After single-handedly obliterating the entirety of eastern europeons existence for the past 1000 years, I felt comfortable enough to take ****. The oval office is a man's place of ideas as they say and while relieving myself I began to ponder: Are all modders pathetic losers? Surely, some mods appear to be okay. For example if someone has a great idea for a new trinket and fires up blender or whatever to realize the virtual item of his dreams in his favorite game and then also goes through the hassle of sharing this work with like-minded nerds and the rest of the world, he or she cannot be a bad person? Or take the dewoking efforts for BG3 by @orinEsque et al. Is she a bad person, beyond being a woman and brown? No, obviously not because the mods are required for a tolerable experience of that game.

This lead me to realize that some modding appears to be okay, basically, and doesn't make you a loser. But it also cannot be denied that most modders are insufferable *******. So logically there ought to be a threshold of modding beyond which you inevitably turn from a normal person into an eastern europeon. I call this the decline horizon. But can this decline horizon then be quantified? And of course that is where things get hairy.

So, I would argue that as long as you mod QoL changes into a game, like fixing bugs, making trinkets, enlarge boobs and whatever else passes for quality in that particular game's life you have not passed the decline horizon. If however you start 'total overhauls' and other such worthless shenanigans where it would really be better for you and the world around you that you do your own goddamn game you are crossing the decline horizon and hurling towards your inevitable doom.

No idea is complete however without exposing it to the shrieking of the uneducated masses scrutiny of esteemed colleagues. So, what is your opinion: does the decline horizon exist or are all modders parasitic losers? And if it exists where would you draw it?

Thanks for your consideration.

Modding is a tool. And like all tools, what matters is who wields it.

Modders are tools.

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

sounds gay

We all find meaning in different ways while living life gay or not.

I have a feeling you are either a woman or gay.

Lives many mysteries that may never be answered.

[Red7]

sounds gay

We all find meaning in different ways while living life gay or not.

I have a feeling you are either a woman or gay.

my bet is fat vagina too fat and ashamed to admit being vagina seeking attention on rpg site or estrogen pumped *****

[Xenich]

It is easier to work from an existing framework than it is to build from scratch.

Building from scratch requires much more core design knowledge/ understanding, time and skill. Taking an existing product which already has a template and functioning framework is far easier to rework as the effort then becomes modifying that template to fit whatever goal.

There are limits obviously if a person is trying to modify to an extent where too much of the framework has to be recreated, but in many cases this isn't the issue.

Take construction for instance, it is far easier to remodel a kitchen than it is to rebuild the entire house in both time, cost, and knowledge unless the goal is so radical that the existing home structure requires massive rework.

Overhauls are often just major adjustments to systems, but not complete rewrites. Most of the assets, code structures, etc... are reused, but various modifications are applied to achieve the intended result.

Basically when this argument is made it sounds like this to me "What the hell are you remodeling that room for, why not just build a new house?"

[orinEsque]

Anecdotal and definitely not meant to represent the average. But i have 0 interest in developing a game myself. I had 0 interest in modding a game too till i walked into bg3 act 3 and found the absolute state of based mods. (Half baked wyll mod, and buggy af BBE)

Never gonna give up what i do for a living to be a game dev. It's just not something I'm invested in. I figure a bunch of modders would feel the same way as me.

That being said people who make mods and then tell others can't use it in their mods because they own it or something needs to go **** themselves.

If i have a good reason to, i would suggest linking to my mod directly. But suggestion is the point where i draw the line. "Would you download a car"... yes. Yes i would.

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

Anecdotal and definitely not meant to represent the average. But i have 0 interest in developing a game myself. I had 0 interest in modding a game too till i walked into bg3 act 3 and found the absolute state of based mods. (Half baked wyll mod, and buggy af BBE)

Never gonna give up what i do for a living to be a game dev. It's just not something I'm invested in. I figure a bunch of modders would feel the same way as me.

I mean who wouldn’t want a job as a game developer who has lower job security then a McDonald’s cashier.

[rusty_shackleford]

Anecdotal and definitely not meant to represent the average. But i have 0 interest in developing a game myself. I had 0 interest in modding a game too till i walked into bg3 act 3 and found the absolute state of based mods. (Half baked wyll mod, and buggy af BBE)

Never gonna give up what i do for a living to be a game dev. It's just not something I'm invested in. I figure a bunch of modders would feel the same way as me.

I mean who wouldn’t want a job as a game developer who has lower job security then a McDonald’s cashier.

It's not about job security, it's about being a cog in a big, homosexual machine with zero input on the final product.

[Statesman]

I did not modify my argument at all, you are just too stupid to comprehend it.

You are right, going from "modders are parasitic losers, that because of inherent inability and/or lazyness cannot create real games and cannot make money off of their supposed talent" to "having an outcome with your profession so as to not live parasitically off the society that supports you" is not just modifying your argument, but completely changing the subject. But hey, if you see nothing wrong with admitting how much you value monetary compensation over actual contributions to society...then there is no need to dwell on it.

Most modders already have a profession and mod on their spare time.

How can they do 'total overhauls' and other superfluous things in their spare time while being a productive member of society and working a 40h week?

Complex mods such as TOs take years to develop less content than full games; modders don't need to work a full second job to contribute. An hour of their spare time is more than enough to slowly labor towards completion.

[Red7]

Anecdotal and definitely not meant to represent the average. But i have 0 interest in developing a game myself. I had 0 interest in modding a game too till i walked into bg3 act 3 and found the absolute state of based mods. (Half baked wyll mod, and buggy af BBE)

Never gonna give up what i do for a living to be a game dev. It's just not something I'm invested in. I figure a bunch of modders would feel the same way as me.

I mean who wouldn’t want a job as a game developer who has lower job security then a McDonald’s cashier.

It's not about job security, it's about being a cog in a big, homosexual machine with zero input on the final product.

waggies love to be exploited tho. "rape me harder state corpo jew daddy"

[Decline]

You are right, going from "modders are parasitic losers, that because of inherent inability and/or lazyness cannot create real games and cannot make money off of their supposed talent" to "having an outcome with your profession so as to not live parasitically off the society that supports you" is not just modifying your argument, but completely changing the subject.

No it isn't. If you are unable to make money because of your laziness or inability you are bound to live a parasitic lifestyle. If you cannot even comprehend this simple logical connection, there is no reason for me to entertain your garbage here any further.

But hey, if you see nothing wrong with admitting how much you value monetary compensation over actual contributions to society...then there is no need to dwell on it.

Earning a lot of money is identical to 'an actual contribution to society' or at least it is that way in the utopian case. But what has that even to do with the argument? Absolutely ******* nothing!

Apparently you struggle with comprehending even simple sentences. So let's try an example: @Brother Chad. He is fairly ideal: He is a one-man-game-shop. He could be a lazy parasitic loser doing total conversion mods. But he isn't. He decided to make his own games. For that he needs to be paid, otherwise he cannot continue. Can you understand this? And while pondering this, is Brother Chad making 'a contribution to society'?

You ******* communist.

[Stack of Turtles]

And while pondering this, is Brother Chad making 'a contribution to society'?

I mean, no? Don't get me wrong, I don't think there's anything wrong with him making all the games he wants, but from the perspective of contribution to society, I know for sure that I'd be willing to feed zero game devs in a zombie apocalypse.

[Decline]

And while pondering this, is Brother Chad making 'a contribution to society'?

I mean, no? Don't get me wrong, I don't think there's anything wrong with him making all the games he wants, but from the perspective of contribution to society, I know for sure that I'd be willing to feed zero game devs in a zombie apocalypse.

M8. If he is making money from his game, he is paying taxes while entertaining a bunch of nerds. That is value. Sure, we can argue how much value that is in relation to let's say a banker. But I find this line of thought inherently revolting and jewish so I leave the measuring up achievements of individuals against each other up to you. And it is unimportant anyway.

What is important here is that the modder makes zero contribution to society and possibly even negative if he decides to entertain the rest of us with his mental garbage like troonism etc.
Edit: Actually the modder is always a negative for society because of opportunity cost, where he is modding instead of working.

[Stack of Turtles]

And while pondering this, is Brother Chad making 'a contribution to society'?

I mean, no? Don't get me wrong, I don't think there's anything wrong with him making all the games he wants, but from the perspective of contribution to society, I know for sure that I'd be willing to feed zero game devs in a zombie apocalypse.

M8. If he is making money from his game, he is paying taxes while entertaining a bunch of nerds. That is value. Sure, we can argue how much value that is in relation to let's say a banker. But I find this line of thought inherently revolting and jewish so I leave the measuring up achievements of individuals against each other up to you. And it is unimportant anyway.

What is important here is that the modder makes zero contribution to society and possibly even negative if he decides to entertain the rest of us with his mental garbage like troonism etc.

Oh, I don't think paying taxes is a good thing at all. If you think taxes are a contribution to society then I have to accede to that guy who called you a Jew.

[Decline]

Oh, I don't think paying taxes is a good thing at all. If you think taxes are a contribution to society then I have to accede to that guy who called you a Jew.

Yeah I am not on board with the liberturdian garbage of "all taxes are theft". I leave that to teenagers and misguided commies. Taxes are not a contribution to society itself but a consequence of creating that value. Still has nothing to do with the argument though.

[Stack of Turtles]

So you're fundamentally defining social value as money. Okay.

[Decline]

So you're fundamentally defining social value as money. Okay.

No, I am not defining anything. Society has agreed upon measuring value in money many thousand years ago. That is the world we live in. What are you going to do about it? Call it Jewish?