Lets read old ibm.pc.games posts together

[rusty_shackleford]

What would you like to see in an RPG game??

https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... IZNOsTRdIJ

I need to find this guy and invite him to the HQ
https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... zYSVHzwd8J

[Acrux]

I hope he found Realms of Arkania. It sounds like he would have really liked it.

[Tweed]

Sounds exactly like the kind of game he wanted, all three of the trilogy were good too. Telling that no one has really made a game like that since.

[rusty_shackleford]

Brad McQuaid advertising WarWizard, an Ultima-influenced RPG.
https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... mSyurIMd0J

You can acquire a copy here:
https://www.myabandonware.com/game/warwizard-bcf

From a look at the screenshots, it seems like a decent find for any early Ultima fan. CRPGAddict implies it's quite good: https://crpgaddict.blogspot.com/2022/01 ... -1993.html

[rusty_shackleford]

https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... Q7EZUvdGoJ

GURPS Computer Game FAQ
----------------------------------------------------------------------


(Frequently Asked Questions) List
Last updated 07/27/95

----------------------------------------------------------------------

What's this about Interplay and GURPS?

Interplay Productions has signed with Steve Jackson Games to convert GURPS
to a computer role-playing game. We, an in-house group of GURPS fanatics
who call ourselves Team GURPS, are hard at work on the first game now.

Who the hell are you?

Hello, I'm Tim Cain. I'm the producer and lead programmer of the project
at Interplay. I've been playing GURPS for over 7 years, and I hope to
translate it faithfully from paper-and-pencil to computer.


What kind of computer game is it?

GURPS will be a turn-based CRPG, with a third-person (isometric) view.
This means you (the player) will view the characters from above, looking
down at an angle (similar to X-Com, Ultima 7, or Syndicate). You will make
one character to represent you, and you can pick up other characters along
the way. All of the characters (you, your allies and the NPC's) will move
on a hex-based grid according to their Move score. All movement, combat
and other actions take place on a turn-by-turn basis.

What genres are covered?

The first game will take place in the near future. We're including most of
the skills in the Basic Set as well as many Hi-Tech weapons, some
Ultra-Tech gadgets, and a few robots.

When will the first game be available?

We're currently aiming for a Christmas '96 release, but as with all
computer game release dates, this is tentative. We'll have more firm
estimates as the year progresses.

May I beta-test it?

Sorry, Interplay has its own well-qualified in-house quality assurance
department. Plus, we can torture them if they let a bug slip by.

What kind of system are you targeting?

The base machine will be a PC 486DX/33 running Windows 95 with 8MB of RAM,
a double-speed CD-ROM drive and an SVGA card (640x480x256 colors). An
ideal machine will have 16 MB of RAM, local-bus video, and a sound card
capable of digital sound output.

Will there be GURPS game for other platforms?


Interplay has a Macintosh division called MacPlay, who may port the game
if there's sufficient interest.

Will there be more GURPS games?

Yes. We are planning on several more, which is why our computer engine is
generic (hmm, just like GURPS). We know you want a Fantasy CRPG, and a
Space and Time Travel version would be fun too.

Will this game be affected by Interplay's TSR Licenses?

No. In fact, GURPS has been improved by those TSR licenses. We are freely
sharing design ideas with the Interplay AD&D producers, and some code may
even be exchanged (mainly interface and graphics stuff). I even convinced
one of the AD&D producers to type in all 800+ spells from GURPS Magic and
Grimoire (he's a big GURPS fan)! How's that for cooperation?

What editions and sourcebooks will Interplay be using?

We are basing the rules on the GURPS Basic Set, Third Edition Revised with
additional info from Ultratech and Robots.

Will characters be interchangeable between games?

We are planning on it. You should be able to take characters from one
GURPS CRPG to any other, with all skills, traits and equipment intact.

How true to real GURPS will the computer version be?

Very close. We'd like to think the computer version will be as close as
you can get to playing GURPS, short of playing GURPS. We're playing close
attention to combat and injury rules, and we plan to make an entire suite
of functions to handle reaction rules (in case anyone makes a Charismatic,
Very Beautiful character with Voice and Sex Appeal).

Are all the skills in GURPS Basic Set used?

No. We are only including those skills that can be used in the game. But
that includes an awful lot of them. Similarly, we are only including the
advantages and disadvantages that make a difference in the game. For
example, if getting 5 points for being a Eunuch doesn't really hurt you
in the game, we're not going to put it in. And we can't really implement
Blindness unless we turn off the screen, so we're leaving that out. But
most of Basic Set is being implemented, if only because we plan to use
those skills extensively in future genres.

Will the game include digitized speech?

Yes. After our internet survey of RPG players and their game preferences
we decided to add digitized speech... it's what most of them wanted. Of
course, you can still have text if you want it, and you can turn the
digitized speech off.

Interesting bits of tid

Nearly all of the art is being rendered on Silicon Graphics workstations.
We also utilize the talents of our 2D and clay modelling departments.
The soundtrack will be 100% digital music.
No animals will be harmed in the making of this product.
This product will have no (detectable) organic pesticide residue.
We own the orbital mind control lasers. Buy more GURPS products

What does fnord mean?

You are not authorized to know.

Similar, but not the same, as the FAQ on the old Fallout site.

[rusty_shackleford]

https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... fxZ76Q4OsU

Hello There,
My name is Brian, and I am one of the many Ultima 9 team members. Right now,
U9 is in the early developemental stage, and we want to know what you, the RPG
fan, would like to see in the next Ultima.

Let me first state that it is our goal to make U9 a much more traditional
Ultima. That is to say that we want U9 to be more like U4 than U8, (yes, we
learned something from U8). U9 will take place in Britannia, will be very
interactive and non linear, and will bring the party back to the Avatar. Any
other suggestions concerning magic, combat, or any other aspect of game play
would be very welcome. Please post any suggestions to this board. Myself and
other U9 team members will be watching for your comments and suggestions. We
want to make a game that you want to play, so who better to tell us what to
include than you?

Thanks for your time,
-Bmartin

It seems the combat of Ultima VII was the most disliked feature.

7) Above all, I don't want to see anything but the classic orthodox
struggle between good and evil. One of the reasons why playing
Serpent Isle made me feel so uncomfortable was that I felt like I
was part of the end of Britannia. After all, when the Banes were
released by Batlin, only a handful of Britannians survived, right?
Also, that pentagram in Ultima VIII sure didn't make me feel any
better. Please leave all that new age stuff out of the storyline,
and stick to the system of the eight virtues standing up against
the Guardian and his evil.

3. Evil people should be evil.
I want motivation. I want dead bodies and crying widows
strewn in the wake of my enemy. I want lots of HATE and MISERY
and ANGUISH to lay at the feet of my enemy.

4. Evil people should be evil during the game, too.
I want to make good friends and useful allies only to have
them kidnapped with taunting notes left behind. I want to see
innocents taken away screaming. I want Blackthorn and the
Shadowlords (U5) -- enemies who make my quest difficult on a
personal, direct and regular basis. I want personal reasons to
be upset with the enemy.

What I liked about U5 is the multiple threats that were everywhere.
Lord British is missing. Blackthorn is the evil tyrant. There are
Shadowlords roaming the countryside. Where do you start? It was
truly an exciting game.

Interesting. It seems a lot of people weren't happy with Garriott's moral relativism that began with Ultima 6.

I'll risk going against popular opinion here and say that I actually
liked the magic system as it evolved through U8. I like mixing regents,
I LOVED the realism of having to arrange components around the penta-
gram in such-and-such an order (guess I got lucky with the pixels).
Please, don't simplify it to the point of making it boring.

Anyone have any opinions on Pagan's magic system? I have not played it yet.

Finally, and I don't know how plausible this is, but could something
be done about the perpetually regenerating monsters? (most obvious
in U7) You don't know how annoying it is to -- let's say after clearing
all the dragons out of that one dungeon -- to go back and find every
single blessed one alive again. That's not even realism -- just
annoying.

I agree strongly with this. Gothic provides a strong foundation for games that don't want to handle granular passage of time by having time move between chapters. This includes monsters respawning(often new spawns, too.)

p.s. - Don't scrap the running and jumping and climbing -- PLEASE.
The physics, at least, kept the U8 world fun. Climbing walls,
running across rooftops. Kinda neat, actually. Just get rid of the
Super Mario Bros. bonus stages (jump, jump. splash, restore saved
game).

Good opinion.

>2. Satisfying resolutions.
> If I kill a local dragon I want every single villager to
>thank me for it when they see me and most of them to have changed
>habits as a result. If I save the world I want a big, flashing
>YOU HAVE SAVED THE WORLD sign and I want every single citizen to
>come up and shake my hand and tell me a personal anecdote about
>how I have made their lives better. The closing animation should
>be blindingly explicit and triumphant, and resolutions during the
>game should be similarly direct. Don't assume I know I've done a
>good deed, don't just tell me "You have done a good deed", SHOW
>ME. There should be no doubt about the consequences of my
>actions.

I agree, still remains something that elevates RPGs when it's done.

Also, people should react not only to the end-game, but to *all*
significant (to them, at least) changes in the game-world. If I go
back to a town after a lot of local adventures, I want the NPCs to
have heard about some of them, and react.

No Generic People! (Except maybe guards). One of the best things about
U7 was all the little life-stories in Brittania, and the fact that most of
them *weren't* directly tied to the main plot.

True.

10. Lots of dynamism in the world.
Gypsies and bards who move from town to town. Roving
brigands. Armies on the march. Lots of things to keep the
Avatar on his toes. Just don't make any obvious links to
unrelated game events -- if the army marches into York right
after I free the Princess, every single time, it looks stupid.
Instead, try "The army will march into York as soon as the player
has completed one of plot objectives A, B, and C and has visited
1-6 (random) more cities." (Time-based flags don't work too well
if the player works quickly. Instead, increment the counter each
time the player goes into a city different from the last city
visited. Or count the number of conversations. Or both.)


11. Genuine time pressure.
Repeatedly emphasize the urgency of the situation - "The
BigNastyFolks take more of us away each day." Count the number
of visits I've made to cities so far. Trigger something
upsetting every N+(1-4) visits. An army blockade? A fire? Lots
of ways to make players' lives unpleasant without making the game
unwinnable. Just make sure we know the time pressure exists.

Things still wished for decades later.

13. Avoid artificial / physical puzzles.
Lever puzzles and logic puzzles and word puzzles look and
feel contrived and have no role-playing in them at all. BORING.
Give me puzzles in the form of problems natural to the world --
"How can I find where the Mage of Veils has gone?" "Who killed
the smith? Why?" "What will persuade the Baron that I'm on his
side?" Puzzles should center around people, not things. Puzzles
should be solved by talking to and investigating people and
making deductions based on the results.

Good point, I've written before about the difference between puzzles & problems. RPGs are about problems, not puzzles.

A few things I have on my wish list: NPC's who, like in Wizardry VII,
took action on their own (using information you traded with them to get
items before you, for instance). A non-linear plot, one that can
unfold as I explore, not one that appears at only certain points in
the game. A party system similar to Ultima VII, except that feeding
members by hand will not be necessary, and a revamped AI so that Iolo
won't keep shooting me in the back. Intelligent puzzles that require
thought to overcome, not simply the manipulation of objects.

It would be interesting to see another avatar show up while you've been
gone, or at least some NPC trying to "finish the game" on their own.
It seems none of the Britannians have the motivation to do anything without
having the avatar lead them around. Be nice to see someone go out on their
own initiative. In Ultima 4, How would it have been different had their
been an independent character trying to become the avatar? I wouldn't have
tried it then since U4 was a different type of game. But for someone else
to be going around, trying to save the world on their own time, could lead
to some interesting problems. All RPGs seem to have at least one big
artifact you need to finish the game. What if someone beats you to it?
In a SNES game called The 7th Saga, seven different people are all searching
for the same 7 objects. Twice in the game the NPCs get there ahead of you,
and you have to decide how to get what you need - by joining them, or
fighting them. I'd like to see some more active NPCs, along these lines.

Again, a lot of people mentioning a desire for a living world. We still severely lack in these types of games.

3. Add *LOTS* of detail

Things like using flour and water to get dough and putting it in
the oven to make breat. Little things like that make the game more
enjoyable. If 'you create worlds' you should create things that are in
the world... just not the land and people. Oh... Add multiple
scheduals in the characters usecode. ie, one day they make eat later
than noraml. One day they make make potions, another day sleep in late.
Hey, why not a random schedual. This would boost replay value! Why not
let the Avatar run a shop... let poeple come in and buy stuff. Even get
an appentace or something... this would help him earn money for reagents
and stuff!

Just beating the dead horse.

In Ultima 7 we have a party of, what, 8 peoples? There is some limited
ability to auto-pilot them using rudimentary command like run, charge,
or defend. Now, it will be a revolution if you can give us ability to
program party members action. Something like:

Iolo:
INIT no_init_spell = TRUE

IF HP_critical critical /\ HAS_Heal_Potion Iolo THEN
DO WITH PRIORITY 5 Use_Heal_Potion Iolo friend ;

IF round < 1 /\ no_init_spell /\
DO WITH PRIORITY 1
BEGIN
spell := pick {Prayer, Invisibility, Strengh} ;
Cast Iolo Iolo spell ;
no_init_spell := FALSE ;
END ;

DO WITH PRIORITY 2
BEGIN
IF no_Enemy_Spell_Casters THEN
Use Iolo Bow (Weakest_Foe)
ELSE Use Iolo Bow (pick Enemy_Spell_Casters) ;

and so on....

FF12 & Dragon Age Origins both had similar systems for programmable party AI that were very well received. I suspect this is probably too powerful if unlimited. I think DAO limits it to your tactics stat(?), but it should probably be a function of one character's tactics skill(functioning as a leader), perhaps with some personal skill/attribute too(functioning as the ability to take orders.) Probably need more personalized/unique tactics, or have each tactics cost be related to the personality of the character so that they don't feel identical.

---

I see very few people mentioning virtues, etc., at all. Seems it was something they weren't concerned about, and perhaps even disliked due to Garriott's moral relativism.
Surprised at how many mentioned wanting the typing interface back.

I still have about half the thread to go thru so I'm going to take a break to make some coffee and late lunch, then finish reading it.

[Faceless_Sentinel]

https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... fxZ76Q4OsU

Hello There,
My name is Brian, and I am one of the many Ultima 9 team members. Right now,
U9 is in the early developemental stage, and we want to know what you, the RPG
fan, would like to see in the next Ultima.

Let me first state that it is our goal to make U9 a much more traditional
Ultima. That is to say that we want U9 to be more like U4 than U8, (yes, we
learned something from U8). U9 will take place in Britannia, will be very
interactive and non linear, and will bring the party back to the Avatar. Any
other suggestions concerning magic, combat, or any other aspect of game play
would be very welcome. Please post any suggestions to this board. Myself and
other U9 team members will be watching for your comments and suggestions. We
want to make a game that you want to play, so who better to tell us what to
include than you?

Thanks for your time,
-Bmartin

That didn't went well:

[rusty_shackleford]

continuation of https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... fxZ76Q4OsU

1. No more arcade actions. Please. This is an RPG game, not an action game. Don't try to blur the lines between different kinds of games. A new idea is nice, but put it into other non-traditional Ultima series, like the 1st person 3D combact system in Ultima Underworld.

The amount of people mentioning this is interesting, all the genres have chocolate in their peanutbutter now.

6. Make the NPC more live-like. Say, when the Avatar wants to do something, Iolo will give a suggestion. Then Durpe will argue with Iolo, and Avatar then turns to Shamino for his advice. If Avatar takes Iolo's suggestion, Durpe will get mad. It comes out that Iolo's suggestion doesn't work and Durpe will laught at him. This is what an interactive game should be, instead of just putting live actors into 256 colors.

True then, true now.

9. Aside from those physical stats like Strength, Wisdom and such, the Avatar should also have a 'popularity' stat. The popularity will change whenever the Avatar accomplish a quest, or do something to the neighborhood in Britannia. (Like stealing should lower his popularity, and killing a tiger that constantly theathen the lives of the villagers will increase it.) Popularity should be directly tied to how the NPC reacts and speaks to him. This is discourage people from stealing in the game. Come on! You a
re the Avatar, with all those 8 virtures. You should not steal in the game!

This is something that would later show up in Fallout, unsure if any other game did it prior.

Another plea on graphics...

*PLEASE* add these lines to Ultima 9 (trust me! !!
asm {
mov ax,0x4f02
mov bx,0x101
int 0x10
cmp ah,0
je NOERROR
jmp ERROR
}
It isn't that hard to make something look better! WC3 is pushing
our systems... Please don't leave Ultima in the cold by not making it
as advanced (but don't advance it to live actors..)

Everyone if you agree that Origin should make Ultima 9 use adavanced
graphics like WC3 is (ie SVGA 640x480 256color), Please tell Brian!

Context: 0x4f02 is related to VESA modesetting, it's a complaint that he wants the games to be in higher resolution/depth.

(i'll also mention that i love the way the way that other complex issues,
such as the racial tensions between the gargoyles and humans, are addressed.
the revisionist history in u7 was wonderful. and it's been done without
getting preachy or pc! no real suggestion here, just a comment.)

LIBTARD ALERT WEEWOO WEEWOO LIBTARD LIBTARD

1) When I'm in a dungeon why can I see sections that are totally unaccessable
from my current position? Allthough in a few situations this is very helpfull to
see which enemy comes next it's a bit unrealistic and a step back in opposit to
U5.

Fair. I'm not a fan of games giving you unlimited field of vision.

It would be even nicer to have the whole series from Ultima 1 to
Ultima 6 redone with the Ultima 7 graphics and engine

So true!

What I like for Ultima is something that came from the Underworld series,
RUNE MAGIC. In UW and UW II the rune magic is almost open ended, there some
undocumented spells, and undocumented spells have a certain charm. Also
rune magic is eaiser to experiment with than reagent spells.

UW magic aged well, yes.

No more of those kind of crap with Frigidazzi! Nastasshia was nice though,
should have been someone/something you should have followed up with.

One of multiple comments regarding Frigidazzi, a woman you're required(?) to have sex with in Ultima 7 part II. It seems this was not popular.

I don't like one-shot items because I'm always afraid to use them.
Whenever I get into a situation where I might find it attractive to use
one, I always think "well sure this monster's tough, and that arrow of
death would be real helpful, but what if there's a tougher critter around
the next corner?" and so never actually use the stupid things. Same with
potions, scrolls, etc. Maybe it's just me.

So true, Aaron, so true.

You want a major plot twist? get this

THE GUARDIAN IS THE AVATAR.

This actually is the plot twist of Ultima 9, isn't it?

---

Some people suggesting a choice between real-time/turn-based. This has been tried a few times and usually results in both sucking.
Again, lots of people wanting turn-based combat.

People suggesting different map scales, which relates to a thread I made some time back regarding abstract representations of the world. I suspect this is probably better than trying to represent a 1:1 world(not gonna work.) I still prefer just picking pieces of the world to show, tho. But having the world map represented at a different scale is probably at minimum a better option. I'm not sure if any 3D games have actually done this 'well', it often looks cartoony? Perhaps the ones that have abstracted it away, I suppose — but then, what's the difference between slice and abstract at that point?
Much to think about!

[Stack of Turtles]

Interesting bits of tid

You're telling me nobody knew this guy was gay????

(adjusting formatting so it doesn't look like I'm accusing Rusty )

[Tweed]

So true!

But the Ultima VI remake in Ultima VII doesn't look right.

[rusty_shackleford]

lmao bethesda used to be called "pathesda"
https://groups.google.com/g/comp.sys.ib ... q=pathesda

Selection_187.jpg

[maidenhaver mk3]

Ultima should have kept the stats-only system and first-person dungeoneering.