Tim Cain creating "Cain on Games" videos

[Acrux]

Tim Cain condones piracy.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Just found out he worked on Wildstar. I liked the 2D art for that game, the cinematic trailers caught a lot of interest, and I was interested in seeing a colorful artbook space fantasy RPG. It was nice that it was an original IP and not yet more Star Trek or Star Wars. I remember the little Chua ratmen with their rayguns being a unique villain race, the Aurin looked cool, the Dominion were cool, and the Stalker class with the laser claws was cool. Shame Tim was pushed aside.




When I downloaded the open beta, I found the ingame aesthetics were lackluster. Environments too simple, characters looked too soft and cutsey and non-threatening. Character and camera movement felt sluggish. Basic attacks/abilities also had a cast bar which felt bad. Overall the moment to moment controlling of the player character didn't feel great, and then the questing was an easy solo experience that didn't incentivize you to group with other players to overcome a challenge and begin building bonds that would result in a guild. I was following the game's megathread on the MMO-Champion forums hoping it'd get better, but the game had really fervent defenders who insisted everything was okay and then you don't have the right to ask that things get better. And then the game went poof and its defenders did too.

He said that he had planned nine classes, but only six made into the final game (Warrior, Medic, Engineer, Esper, Spellslinger, and Stalker). I wonder what the other three were that got cut. I thought Stalker and Spellslinger were pretty unique, I wonder if those three missing classes would have been just as unique too.

Hearing the behind the scenes malice and then reading through the comments and hearing this happening at other studios like Ubisoft is pretty disheartening.

[Rand]

Half Life 2 ( no, really )
Vampire Survivors

What The ****? Does he remember what an RPG is?

He later praises Skyrim for its art, which puzzles me... It's grey and generic viking fantasy stuff with... wyverns

YES!!!
Those are NOT dragons.
******* two-legged "dragons" annoy me.

[rusty_shackleford]

In one of his videos he talks about a designer who thought it was his goal to kill the player, which the designer said came from his experience as a DM. He didn't refer to any specific person, however.
I thought about it for a bit and I wonder if he was referring to soyer


Guess I could cross reference the projects he's worked on and the designers on those projects.

[Vergil]

Tim Cain condones piracy.

I'll keep that in mind when Farter Worlds 2 drops

[Humbaba]

He probably made the whole thing up, lying homo that he is.

[Roguey]

In one of his videos he talks about a designer who thought it was his goal to kill the player, which the designer said came from his experience as a DM. He didn't refer to any specific person, however.
I thought about it for a bit and I wonder if he was referring to soyer


Guess I could cross reference the projects he's worked on and the designers on those projects.

Doubt it since that's not an attitude he's ever expressed through his statements or his games.

[Classix]

He said that he had planned nine classes, but only six made into the final game (Warrior, Medic, Engineer, Esper, Spellslinger, and Stalker). I wonder what the other three were that got cut. I thought Stalker and Spellslinger were pretty unique, I wonder if those three missing classes would have been just as unique too.

The other 3 Classes planned were: "Dark Weaver", "Sorcerer" and "Charmer"

I got into a couple closed beta's with some guild/site I had joined that had some youtube or round table video talks about it or something. There were a couple dozen keys handed out and I got one and tried it out for the closed period, then again a second time with different classes a month or so later ish. Saw some GM's in game, people were asking questions to and speaking with at a starter area main hub town. I played for a few months when it was live and my brother and I tried all the classes but settled on only 3 or 4 that we liked.

- We had a team of two Mechari Medics with names ( you could use a 'dash' - ) like " Medical-Unit " and "Surgical-Unit", rounding up all nearby mobs and burning down plus attacks that healed. Easy leveling with them, busted duo.
- Duo Drakari Warriors and duo Drakari Stalkers
- And we had duo Mordesh Engineers. Similar to the medics team with an added Pet each but not as effective like the Duo Medics.

Tried PvP only twice. Absolute mess of telegraphs and animation sparkles everywhere. Never went back. I think highest we got was 30 maybe 40 something? Never got into the housing stuff, just placed my down and some stuff the the rested xp bonuses they gave and that was it. We explored everything we could mostly. Had a lot of fun though at this one teleporter area. Mobs would be guarding a teleporter pad that transported you to an interior/or to another height level in some mini dungeon quest area. If you body pulled them off and just led them back a ways ( off the pad area ) the pad area would assume they were defeated and spawned another group of 3 or 4 in after maybe 20 secs? ... so when your kited group would de-aggro off you and head back to their positions now there's 2 groups of 4 and almost completely inside each other idleing on the pad.

We did this 4 or 5 times and had like 20+ spawns all idleing on top of one another and we'd sit and stealth on the Stalkers and watch people come on, pull the group to get onto the telepad and get rushed and obliterated in seconds by the multi spawns all stack on top of eachother lol. They would start to despawn after like 5 mins starting at the oldest group but we kept it refreshed and had a laugh for a couple hours one night doing this.

Here's the video with the extra class mentions:

[Vergil]

Tim Cain creating AIDs in his ****** ***

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Here's the video with the extra class mentions:

Thanks for the find.

Interesting how he designed the setting first, then the story, and then the game mechanics. As opposed to Blizzard's mantra of "gameplay first" where they contort their lore and aesthetics and pull nonsense out of nowhere, and a lot of the gameplay doesn't make sense in the story (ie female Night Elf druids, Warlocks in the Alliance, Church of the Light priests that can wield dark magic, Blood Elves joining the Horde, Light worshipping paladins on both factions, humans channeling Pandaren monk powers, etc).

I liked his idea of all classes not having a happy/good guy sparkle aesthetic. The medic healer using magitek devices still stands out in my mind as one of the most unique RPG healers I have seen, since most RPG healers are good hearted all loving heroes who throw out sparkle. Even in the ostensibly badass powermetal fantasy World of Warcraft, all of the healers throw out sparkles. Not a single blood mage/life force stealer/redistributor healer or magitek device user or chemist who mixes and matches potions and throws them there to pick from. I really wish more RPGs had non-sparkle healers.

The Charmer reminds me of one of the Assembly faction classes from Lego Universe, the engineer summoner with the shepard's staff. That might have been neat.

[rusty_shackleford]

It's a shame cain is gay

The other thing I hate is when a game states a general role and then doesn't follow through. Not going to tell you what it is, but a very popular RPG in the 90's did this. I was asked to go find an NPC. When you find them, they're dead. They were killed recently, and the intention was you pick up the body and take it back and go 'Oh sorry, here they are, they're dead.'

But I was playing a cleric, and even though I wasn't high enough level to raise dead, I had a 'Raise Dead' scroll, and that scroll said it worked for anyone who'd been dead up to 9 days. And I knew this person couldn't have been dead for more than three days - I knew it. They were alive and home 3 days before, but I couldn't raise them from the dead. I'd cast the scroll, click on the dead body, and it would say 'Invalid Target.'

I was angry because: a) it wasted the scroll, I had to reload and I lost about 20 minutes of gameplay, but I was... I remember finding myself as a game designer going, 'Why did they give me that scroll? Someone put it in the game, and then why did they make this quest? It doesn't even follow the rule of that scroll.'

I thought what was going to happen was I was going to raise this person. I was going to go back and, you know, the person who sent me on the quest like, 'Oh my goodness, you found him! Thank you so much,' blah blah blah. Nope. Nope. There was only one way to solve it, and that was to bring back the dead body and go, 'They're dead.'

It was Baldur's Gate, by the way. I think I tried the same thing.

[rusty_shackleford]

Decided to watch some of these because I was bored.
One video contains a long rant on narrative designers doing nothing but writing sarcastic characters.
Lots of stuff about how people who came from writing books/movies being unable to write nonlinearly.

basically, everything I suspected was happening at nusidian.
and cain can't critique it because he decided to be a libtard so he has to just talk about the symptoms.

[Vergil]

Decided to watch some of these because I was bored.
One video contains a long rant on narrative designers doing nothing but writing sarcastic characters.
Lots of stuff about how people who came from writing books/movies being unable to write nonlinearly.

basically, everything I suspected was happening at nusidian.
and cain can't critique it because he decided to be a libtard so he has to just talk about the symptoms.

His videos can be enjoyable and interesting to throw on in the background but he has some real eye rollers in there too.

[rusty_shackleford]

His videos can be enjoyable and interesting to throw on in the background but he has some real eye rollers in there too.

I've only watched ones directly related to video games, I know he made one boohooing about people asking him to stop discussing taking cocks up his *** and probably more of those by now

[Vergil]

His videos can be enjoyable and interesting to throw on in the background but he has some real eye rollers in there too.

I've only watched ones directly related to video games, I know he made one boohooing about people asking him to stop discussing taking cocks up his *** and probably more of those by now

I can't recall if the one where he cries about women not being okay with some degenerate ****** using the women's restroom at interplay was in a game related video or not.

[rusty_shackleford]

kinda crazy that someone will spend his life doing something, see it be completely destroyed by those come after him, but he cares more about not being able to put cocks up his bum than saving what he worked on his entire life

need to look into curing gay tbh

[Vergil]

need to look into curing gay tbh

[Tweed]

Time for a turpentine big gulp.

[rusty_shackleford]

"I couldn't pick a faction[in FNV] so I just saved and played all of them… supporting House, supporting Yes man, supporting Caesar's Legion [begins to talk about something else] … oh, supporting NCR"

[Vergil]

"I couldn't pick a faction[in FNV] so I just saved and played all of them… supporting House, supporting Yes man, supporting Caesar's Legion [begins to talk about something else] … oh, supporting NCR"

Not even Time Cainal likes the NCR... diabolic

[rusty_shackleford]

"grey morality"
*look closer*
*the bad guy is the good guy*

Let's look at that perennial Fallout quest: Gizmo versus Killian in Junktown. If you remember that one, the player arrives at Junktown and quickly learns that the sheriff, Killian, is kind of in a standoff with Gizmo, the overweight owner of the local casino.

Gizmo wants to expand; he wants to do a lot of other things. Killian basically believes that Gizmo has done a lot of immoral things and wants to take him down. He needs proof. You get involved in evidence gathering, picking a side, and acting on it.

This is a real choice that comes along in the game. The player is forced to choose one side—which side dies, basically. Interestingly enough, we tried to present that as no side being right, and I know that sounds strange because people are like, "Well, of course Gizmo is evil! He's an amoral crime lord. Why would anyone side with him?"

Well, Junktown is doing better because of his casino. It's bringing in caps, it's bringing in people. And so the original slide for that said that if you pick Gizmo, Junktown thrives. It becomes bigger. It does way better under him economically. Yes, he's still a crime lord. Yes, he does questionable things, but most people are better off under him.

Killian, on the other hand, is very fair and impartial, but he follows the letter of the law. Our original slide implied that Junktown does not do well under him. It suffers, mainly because justice is not—justice is never as easy as a rulebook, and that's how Killian treats the law. You know, the most minor infraction must be punished horrifically.

He doesn't actually explain the downside of picking Gizmo. If everyone is objectively better off under him, then what is the 'grey' part?
"heh you get to pick between a town not existing or the town thriving, what a grey morality choice!"

[Oyster Sauce]

"grey morality"
*look closer*
*the bad guy is the good guy*

Let's look at that perennial Fallout quest: Gizmo versus Killian in Junktown. If you remember that one, the player arrives at Junktown and quickly learns that the sheriff, Killian, is kind of in a standoff with Gizmo, the overweight owner of the local casino.

Gizmo wants to expand; he wants to do a lot of other things. Killian basically believes that Gizmo has done a lot of immoral things and wants to take him down. He needs proof. You get involved in evidence gathering, picking a side, and acting on it.

This is a real choice that comes along in the game. The player is forced to choose one side—which side dies, basically. Interestingly enough, we tried to present that as no side being right, and I know that sounds strange because people are like, "Well, of course Gizmo is evil! He's an amoral crime lord. Why would anyone side with him?"

Well, Junktown is doing better because of his casino. It's bringing in caps, it's bringing in people. And so the original slide for that said that if you pick Gizmo, Junktown thrives. It becomes bigger. It does way better under him economically. Yes, he's still a crime lord. Yes, he does questionable things, but most people are better off under him.

Killian, on the other hand, is very fair and impartial, but he follows the letter of the law. Our original slide implied that Junktown does not do well under him. It suffers, mainly because justice is not—justice is never as easy as a rulebook, and that's how Killian treats the law. You know, the most minor infraction must be punished horrifically.

He doesn't actually explain the downside of picking Gizmo. If everyone is objectively better off under him, then what is the 'grey' part?
"heh you get to pick between a town not existing or the town thriving, what a grey morality choice!"

Just a theory but I think the downside is that he's a murderer who kills innocent people

[rusty_shackleford]

"grey morality"
*look closer*
*the bad guy is the good guy*

Let's look at that perennial Fallout quest: Gizmo versus Killian in Junktown. If you remember that one, the player arrives at Junktown and quickly learns that the sheriff, Killian, is kind of in a standoff with Gizmo, the overweight owner of the local casino.

Gizmo wants to expand; he wants to do a lot of other things. Killian basically believes that Gizmo has done a lot of immoral things and wants to take him down. He needs proof. You get involved in evidence gathering, picking a side, and acting on it.

This is a real choice that comes along in the game. The player is forced to choose one side—which side dies, basically. Interestingly enough, we tried to present that as no side being right, and I know that sounds strange because people are like, "Well, of course Gizmo is evil! He's an amoral crime lord. Why would anyone side with him?"

Well, Junktown is doing better because of his casino. It's bringing in caps, it's bringing in people. And so the original slide for that said that if you pick Gizmo, Junktown thrives. It becomes bigger. It does way better under him economically. Yes, he's still a crime lord. Yes, he does questionable things, but most people are better off under him.

Killian, on the other hand, is very fair and impartial, but he follows the letter of the law. Our original slide implied that Junktown does not do well under him. It suffers, mainly because justice is not—justice is never as easy as a rulebook, and that's how Killian treats the law. You know, the most minor infraction must be punished horrifically.

He doesn't actually explain the downside of picking Gizmo. If everyone is objectively better off under him, then what is the 'grey' part?
"heh you get to pick between a town not existing or the town thriving, what a grey morality choice!"

Just a theory but I think the downside is that he's a murderer who kills innocent people

The alternative is the people in the town get to go wander the wastes and likely either end up as a raider, enslaved, or dead.
It is objectively the worse choice.

[Oyster Sauce]

"grey morality"
*look closer*
*the bad guy is the good guy*



He doesn't actually explain the downside of picking Gizmo. If everyone is objectively better off under him, then what is the 'grey' part?
"heh you get to pick between a town not existing or the town thriving, what a grey morality choice!"

Just a theory but I think the downside is that he's a murderer who kills innocent people

The alternative is the people in the town get to go wander the wastes and likely either end up as a raider, enslaved, or dead.
It is objectively the worse choice.

Brown

[rusty_shackleford]

Just a theory but I think the downside is that he's a murderer who kills innocent people

The alternative is the people in the town get to go wander the wastes and likely either end up as a raider, enslaved, or dead.
It is objectively the worse choice.

Brown

"you get to choose between an evil guy killing people who engage in crime, or… slavers!"
wow what a grey morality choice

[rusty_shackleford]

this is like the producer for sopranos shocked that people liked tony because he killed bad people

[wndrbr]

Tim Cain couldn't have just used a regular photo of himself as an icon for his channel. No, he has to wear a peaked cap, like those leather bikers.

[Acrux]

People only liked Killian because of Richard Dean Anderson.

[rusty_shackleford]

Wow, Tim Cain is a major bigot…

A lot of people, even people on this channel, are really into romancing companions. I just never got into that because it strikes me as, first of all, in a lot of games it feels like a weird add-on. It's like this person is wanting to do their side quest and they've joined you and all this, and then by the way, as soon as they get back to camp, they're like, "Ooh, you're hot!"

Also, to make it work with no matter what kind of player character you've made, the male companions have to hit on you, the female companions have to hit on you, the different races that the companions can be have to hit on you. So if there's a lizard man and there's a demon and whatever, they all hit on you. And it just makes the world feel like, "Wow, the world is full of all these really horny people."

It's... if that's not what I want, then I don't want that to be reflected in the companions. So often I'm just, "Let's take romance off the table."

[rusty_shackleford]

I refuse to believe there are people who don't like having companions in RPGs btw