ELEX Thread

[lucky-SVLLa]

Let's discuss this Eurojank, shall we? Share your current opinions after so many years

ELEX Cinematic Trailer

[lucky-SVLLa]

I don't think ELEX can compare to Gothic 2. However, there are still many commendable aspects of ELEX.

[lucky-SVLLa]

That being said, ELEX's weaknesses are quite glaring. However, considering what ELEX excels at is impressive. A flawed, yet enjoyable example of Eurojank. Wait, is that the case?

[Mikeal]

Good game with some flaws.

[rusty_shackleford]

fun, underrated outside of certain circles, AG material if someone wants to nominate it

[Rienen]

I liked the first Elex but struggled to get into the second. Mars War Logs has always my go to "jank game" recommendation. That campy, imperfect game struck a chord with me and I've been buying Spiders games since, trying to chase that feeling.

[rusty_shackleford]

I liked the first Elex but struggled to get into the second. Mars War Logs has always my go to "jank game" recommendation. That campy, imperfect game struck a chord with me and I've been buying Spiders games since, trying to chase that feeling.

Elex 2 is just bad, solid SKIP. I found it to be much worse than Risen 2 or Risen 3.

Have you played Technomancer?

[Rienen]

I liked the first Elex but struggled to get into the second. Mars War Logs has always my go to "jank game" recommendation. That campy, imperfect game struck a chord with me and I've been buying Spiders games since, trying to chase that feeling.

Elex 2 is just bad, solid SKIP. I found it to be much worse than Risen 2 or Risen 3.

Have you played Technomancer?

Played, yes. Beaten, no. I've got about 18hrs across 2 playthroughs. I really need to go back and play it all the way through.

[Tweed]

ELEX 2 was terrible, I barely made it about 20 minutes in. ELEX was loads of fun.

[Rand]

ELEX is okay.
Full of baffling design decisions and jank, but still okay.

The start has an initially closed tutorial, but goes for the second part into the open world where it seems to be half actively trying to kill the player.
Your escort can even be killed rather easily if you stray just slightly off the (unknown and not very obvious to the new player) path and run back with a particularly dangerous enemy (or more than one) after you.

The world is rather half-assed as well.
The barbarian encampment that you are directed to first has at best one guard at every wide-open gate, and several of them at the worst places with enemies just beyond have no guards at all.
It's hilariously poorly thought out.

One of the first missions is to head up a long highway that has ridiculously tough mid-lategame enemies in interesting locations just off the road.

[Xenich]

I liked the first Elex but struggled to get into the second. Mars War Logs has always my go to "jank game" recommendation. That campy, imperfect game struck a chord with me and I've been buying Spiders games since, trying to chase that feeling.

Elex 2 is just bad, solid SKIP. I found it to be much worse than Risen 2 or Risen 3.

Have you played Technomancer?

I loved Elex, with the usual objections here and there, but over all fun and well done game. After Risen, I just couldn't adapt to the changes they made in Risen 2/3 which felt like console slop, but I get your point about it compared to Elex 2, which agreed, horrible.

Technomancer? Never tried it... Worth it then?

[DrSneed]

Way too jank and the setting didn't interest me at all, so I dropped it after 5 hours.

[Xenich]

In this context, what do people mean by "jank"? I know variations of the term, but never really understood specifically what people meant because it isn't used specifically to a standard.

Is it things like being able to step a bit outside of an intended design of a mechanic? Using things like environment and the like maybe a bit outside of the developers original design to defeat an encounter?

In terms of Elex, and pretty much all gothic type games, I always actually liked that aspect of play. Base game design is a certain way, but through clever approaches, or excessive practice and timing with some "luck" a player is able to topple encounters that are outside of the progression flow which gives a nice "accomplishment" feel when you beat an encounter you know was a bit too high for your characters statistical realm of intent.

Granted, there are limits where the "jank" is too easy a solution and this kills the game, making it seem like a poor design. I always liked that balance of where this type of "exploit" existed, but it wasn't something easily accomplished, requiring planning, careful execution as well as a bit of luck.

In these cases, I actually enjoy "jank" in a game. In all honesty, I always viewed this type of play (with in reason) as the objective of the player. That is, the developer is attempting to best the player and the player is trying to find any means to do the same. I think back to some of my most enjoyable moments in gaming and it is where that balance was met.

[rusty_shackleford]

Technomancer? Never tried it... Worth it then?

Technomancer is more like a low budget Mass Effect, not too much like ELEX

Way too jank and the setting didn't interest me at all, so I dropped it after 5 hours.

It's great tho

[Tweed]

We got two types of people here. Those who enjoy PB jank and those who need to GET OUT.

[Rand]

In this context, what do people mean by "jank"?

Clumsy design, game mechanics, interactivity, and/or dialogue.
Something that is harder to interact with effectively than the generally well-made games.

[Xenich]

In this context, what do people mean by "jank"?

Clumsy design, game mechanics, interactivity, and/or dialogue.
Something that is harder to interact with effectively than the generally well-made games.

Hmm...

I understand what you mean to an extent, but not fully in terms of people who would make the objections.

In some games, I have seen people say a game is "janky" in that context, but it was due tot them not understanding and fully learning the function of the games play, like they expected the game to be simplistic like a console where you hit a button and everything is done for you.

I guess part of my confusion is maybe from era? Some might call Doom or early open movement, no "cover position" or similar concepts "janky" when considering a a FPS, but I found them just to be the manner in which you played them and how you adapted to their movement and play (ie hiding behind a corner wasn't simply hitting a button).

It makes me wonder how many games are identified as "janky" when in fact they are simply too much "freedom" to the player that creates a perception that the game is lacking in its controls?

[Rand]

Doom wasn't janky, except for firing at different levels.
Gothic was.
Ultima Underworld was a bit.
Descent to Undermountain was very janky.

[Kalarion]

In this context, what do people mean by "jank"?

Clumsy design, game mechanics, interactivity, and/or dialogue.
Something that is harder to interact with effectively than the generally well-made games.

Jank also usually comes with an overtone of charm, fondness, hominess. Hence, Eurojank (like ELEX), Slavjank (ATOM), Arcanum, Fallout, stuff like that. It can be used in a purely derogatory fashion but I find that rare. Usually if something is technically inept or buggy without also being fun to play, people just call it slop or ****.

[lucky-SVLLa]

If there is something wrong with my thoughts, I will try to experience Mars War Log again. But regarding eurojank, is Mars War Log really close to ELEX in feeling? I can tolerate Bound by Flame, but Mars War Log and Faery: Legends of Avalon are almost unbearable for me, not because they are overly janky, but because the systems and mechanics seem overly simplified. So, what do you think of Of Orcs and Men and Game of Thrones (the 2012 RPG)? How do they compare to Mars War Log?

[rusty_shackleford]

If there is something wrong with my thoughts, I will try to experience Mars War Log again. But as for eurojank, is Mars War Log really close to ELEX as for the feeling? I can tolerate Bound by Flame, but Mars War Log and Faery: Legends of Avalon are almost unbearable for me, not because they are overly janky, but because the systems and mechanics seem overly simplified. So, what do you think of Of Orcs and Men and Game of Thrones (2012 RPG)? How do they compare to Mars War Log?

Mars War Logs is unfinished, basically a proof of concept for Technomancer than anything.

[rusty_shackleford]

@lucky-SVLLa are you looking for a game more similar to ELEX, War Logs, or just eurojank in general?

[lucky-SVLLa]

@lucky-SVLLa are you looking for a game more similar to ELEX, War Logs, or just eurojank in general?

How should I put it? I already own quite a few rpgs/crpgs that are considered Eurojank, and I even think some isometric CRPGs made by Europeans can be considered to have the Eurojank spirit. So I think I know most of the more mainstream ones. What I'm looking for are more niche games, similar to ELEX or Eurojank in general

[rusty_shackleford]

@lucky-SVLLa are you looking for a game more similar to ELEX, War Logs, or just eurojank in general?

How should I put it? I already own quite a few rpgs/crpgs that are considered Eurojank, and I even think some isometric CRPGs made by Europeans can be considered to have the Eurojank spirit. So I think I know most of the more mainstream ones. What I'm looking for are more niche games, similar to ELEX or Eurojank in general

Have you played Archolos?

[lucky-SVLLa]

@lucky-SVLLa are you looking for a game more similar to ELEX, War Logs, or just eurojank in general?

Regarding Mars War Log, apart from some unique aspects, Spiders' RPGs generally remind me of modern BioWare's style—a cinematic, third-person role-playing experience. In fact, Spiders has noted that their main inspiration comes from BioWare’s golden age. That said, I plan to continue playing Mars War Log to better understand the roots of Spiders’ design approach.

Nonetheless, I'm still confused. Among some groups, Mars War Logs is sometimes rated so highly that it makes me suspect they're actually evaluating GreedFall.

[lucky-SVLLa]

@lucky-SVLLa are you looking for a game more similar to ELEX, War Logs, or just eurojank in general?

How should I put it? I already own quite a few rpgs/crpgs that are considered Eurojank, and I even think some isometric CRPGs made by Europeans can be considered to have the Eurojank spirit. So I think I know most of the more mainstream ones. What I'm looking for are more niche games, similar to ELEX or Eurojank in general

Have you played Archolos?

absolutely adore Archolos, but haven't gotten around to finishing it. Too many other things have gotten in the way.

[Maledict]

What games would yous recommend to someone who's never played anything Piranha and in what order to see if it is something up to my taste?

Do you get to make your own character in any of their games visually, or do you always play a pre-set man? If so, is the character White in every game, or do they make you play a brownoid in any of them?

[Tangerine]

Mars War Logs is sometimes rated so highly

They're lying to you.

[Rand]

What games would yous recommend to someone who's never played anything Piranha and in what order to see if it is something up to my taste?

Do you get to make your own character in any of their games visually, or do you always play a pre-set man? If so, is the character White in every game, or do they make you play a brownoid in any of them?

If I recall correctly:
Always preset, always a white guy.

As for which to play... tough one.
I started with the original Gothic about 15 years ago.
It was janky as hell and tough even for me and I'll put up with a lot, but I had fun and finished it.
But I'm not sure it's something I would recommend to others given how hard it is to even learn to use the controls proficiently in.
Definitely not Gothic 2. They ****** up and adjusted it for the experts of the first game and it's hard as **** and filters newcomers immediately due to the punishing difficulty if you aren't already an expert.
(For example, you can dodge or block, but the game doesn't tell you that blocking doesn't work on enemies not using hand weapons, so animals will wipe the floor with you if you try. And they'll probably get you if you dodge anyway, if you aren't already good at knowing when to time it, too...)
Gothic 3 may be the easiest to get into, but I don't think it's a good first game.
I'm tempted to say Risen, but that'll filter a lot of players because it's not easy.
ELEX is easier, but I also don't think it's a good first PB game for other reasons.

I don't know. Maybe try Gothic 3 and see what you think?
If you generally like it, know that most of the others are better, but harder to play.

[Maledict]

ELEX is easier, but I also don't think it's a good first PB game for other reasons.

Can you elaborate as to why?