long-running videogame franchises that got better with each new entry

[Unhelpful Contrarian]

It was decent. Felt like it was going through the motions but an overall solid experience. The same can not be said with the soft reboot series.

Some of the interviews are rage inducing” I remember them saying something in the lines of “ we made a actual real story with a scrip not a video game story”

These are failed screenwriters hacks who couldn’t make it to Hollywood.

Was it Barlog that started the narrative of "old games had no story depth"? I remember watching the documentary for the 2018 game and he was saying that becoming a parent changed how he approached the game. While I won't completely **** on the guy and thought the core idea he had wasn't bad per se, the execution was way too "Last of Us"/ Hollywood-esque for me to take seriously. Not just in terms of story, but also in terms of gameplay. I was never a fan of the OTS camera and lack of any verticality.

The story became even more **** in Ragnarok and some of the things in that was so ******* ********. Freya was ******* insufferable and Atreus was even more of a nuisance and a ******. Some of the lines were painful like "Bow to your Queen" by Freya. Did I mention how insufferable she was? Don't forget Angrboda and her ****** grandma. The Atreus sections were pure cancer. It's funny because I found the combat more enjoyable in Ragnarok but everything else was so much worse. In fact, it's probably the only saving grace of the game, and even then, the OTS camera is ******* annoying.

Game devs like Barlog have a complete misunderstanding of story writing in games. They think that can slap typical cinematic filming techniques in games and call it a day instead of incorporating the story into its gameplay.( something that originally trilogy did to a much better effect)

How is that game devs understanding this 30 plus decades ago but modern devs are utterly clueless to basic concept.

[Brother Michael]

Maybe Earth Defense Force? I don’t think people have much expectations for them anyways lol

[DDC]

Maybe Earth Defense Force? I don’t think people have much expectations for them anyways lol

EDF is in my top 5 series of all time, but EDF6 is a huge step back from EDF5. Bad new enemies that aren't fun to fight, extremely tedious campaign, and most importantly, they killed the Air Raider and turned a lot of his kit into trash. It has some missions that are as good as any that have ever been in the series, but they are surrounded by so much bloat that it kills the replay value. Then there is also Iron Rain.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Falcom's 13 game long Trails series of JRPGs has stayed within the same general range of quality. The quality of the writing and the soundtracks has declined somewhat, but holistically they are still at the very least 7/10 games I have enjoyed enough to finish and to look forward to the next one. I think the only Trails game I rated less than a 7/10 was Ao, mainly because of the writing of the ending which left a very sour taste in my mouth regarding Crossbell and its characters, who you see in three more Trails games after that.

[J-12]

The new trilogy is pretty much its own new game unrelated to previous 4 (and the devs managed to disown the fifth one for literally no reason in one of the easter eggs, like it was their crack-addicted son despite being generally warmly accepted by most who played it).
It's perfect for normies who just want to pretend they like stealth games or want to chill and de-stress in some sandbox where they can roleplay a clown who's running around bonking NPCs with basebal bat, but the older games were while a lot more restrictive and had much less content were also a lot more serious and striking in tones, themes and visuals.

As far as I know, the recent 'Hitman - World of Assassination' trilogy was good. Hitman series had its dips, but even the weakest game (Absolution) still wasn't all that bad.

[rusty_shackleford]

It's perfect for normies who just want to pretend they like stealth games

Hitman games are the only actual stealth games I'm aware of. I don't consider crouching simulators or crawling thru vents to be 'actual stealth'.

[Tweed]

It's perfect for normies who just want to pretend they like stealth games

Hitman games are the only actual stealth games I'm aware of. I don't consider crouching simulators or crawling thru vents to be 'actual stealth'.

I was detected, oh well, guess I'll just have to shoot everyone!

[J-12]

Well you do get to do both of those in newer games, especially if you aiming for those **** achivements for "suit only/silent assassin". Those aren't hard, you just need to repeat after speedrunners.
It's kinda stupid how the game where one of the main features always was dressing up in someone else's uniform to pass trough restricted areas have became something you must avoid or else you get penalized.

I don't consider crouching simulators or crawling thru vents to be 'actual stealth'

[rusty_shackleford]

It's kinda stupid how the game where one of the main features always was dressing up in someone else's uniform to pass trough restricted areas have became something you must avoid or else you get penalized.

I haven't played any of the new ones so I can't comment. I think the last one I played was probably Absolution.

[J-12]

It was a good and fun game for 2012, i remember there was first John Wick movie that came out at the time and both were jokingly compared a lot, because how most people would play it like a shooter instead of stealth. Some very loud minority would debate that because of that this isn't a hitman game, that this game is bad, etc. Those people were morons who must've never finished any other game in the series before that, because if they did they'd know that going loud was always a thing you could do in every game in the seires, which was usually accompanied with very funny ragdolling, not to mention it was a requirement for each final level quadrilogy.

There's also was pretty funny connection with John Wick in Trilogy - the elite guards are voiced by the same VA who voiced JW in Payday 2.
Meanwhile in Payday John was added alongside with character-related deck of perk-cards called "Hitman", it was focused on using akimbo weapons.

I haven't played any of the new ones so I can't comment. I think the last one I played was probably Absolution.

[LemonDemonGirl]

Mario Kart games seem to be getting better

[Witchgrove Games]

Ultima to a certain point, but I have quite mixed feelings if the pinnacle was reached with IV or VII. In the end I guess I would choose IV because of the idea of mastering all the virtues and becoming Avatar.

Wizardry also got better and I think VII was the high point of the series. I've tried to get into VIII multiple times, but for some reason I've failed every time. The game just doesn't click with me for some reason.

Zelda got better, but after Majora's Mask (which I think is the best in the series) it's been downhill. Though I wouldn't say that Zelda 2 was better than the 1st one, but I take this opportunity to say that I think that Castlevania 2 was better than the 1st one and even with some irritating aspects I think it's still the best game in the series. **** the Angry Video Game Nerd for starting the collective internet hate for that game - don't blame the game if you suck at it, the gameplay mechanic (moving and attacking) is basically the same with the 1st one. I was able to play it through when I was 9 years old without any guides and I was able to do it again after 30 years even though I had forgotten most of it. When it comes to console games it was ahead of it's time, the true foundation of metroidvanias, alongside with Metroid and The Goonies 2, another underappreciated game with some rough edges.

But yeah, even though these series mentioned got better, they weren't able to keep it up after a certain point.

[rusty_shackleford]

Wizardry also got better and I think VII was the high point of the series. I've tried to get into VIII multiple times, but for some reason I've failed every time. The game just doesn't click with me for some reason.

I've never played VII because I want to play them as a trilogy but didn't finish VI. I should get around to that sometime.

[Witchgrove Games]

Wizardry also got better and I think VII was the high point of the series. I've tried to get into VIII multiple times, but for some reason I've failed every time. The game just doesn't click with me for some reason.

I've never played VII because I want to play them as a trilogy but didn't finish VI. I should get around to that sometime.

Some say VI is better than VII, but I think VII was an improvement. VII will definitely benefit if VI is played first, especially when using the same party.

[Manny V]

glad my doomposting got turned into something productive

that said none of the franchises mentioned are ones i give a **** about


it's so over....

[Statesman]

There has never been a bad Metroid game, and Metroid Dread is awesome.

Even Other M and Federation Force?

Federation Force isn't really a Metroid game. That's like treating Mario Golf as an indicator of quality for the Mario series.

I think Other M is tragically underrated. The Prime games got rave reviews, but I found them boring and not true to the franchise. I consider Other M a better attempt to translate classic Metroid gameplay to 3D.

Federation Force is a spinoff, so I kind of agree...but if we followed that line of thought to its logical conclusion, neither Prime or Other M should be considered as part of the main series. The topic title/opening statement specified videogame franchises as a whole, so attempting to rationalize it might moot taking that into context.

Now, Other M is trash. The third-person view is about the only thing that it has (over Prime) that could be said to have helped it translate classic Metroid Gameplay to 3D, since it foregoes most Metroid series staples. The gameplay is more akin to an action game (auto-aim ). Poor controls killed off precise movements and skilled platforming (shouldn't have focused on fitting everything within the Wiimote's capabilities). Other M also lacks proper exploration and foregoes atmospheric storytelling to focus on a story-driven/cinematic heavy on-rails experience that amounted to a Samus/Adam character assassination. Graphics ended up being downgrade to the Prime series, even though it released 3 years after Prime 3 and was fully developed for the Wii.

I suppose it could be considered average if you evaluated the game on its own merits (outside the Metroid franchise) and played one of the overhaul mods that fixed a lot of the issues with the vanilla release.

[Xenich]

It's perfect for normies who just want to pretend they like stealth games

Hitman games are the only actual stealth games I'm aware of. I don't consider crouching simulators or crawling thru vents to be 'actual stealth'.

You don't consider the Thief series stealth?

[wndrbr]

Some very loud minority would debate that because of that this isn't a hitman game, that this game is bad, etc. Those people were morons who must've never finished any other game in the series

I was one of the people who shat on Absolution. However, my peeve wasn't that "you can shoot your way through", but rather the fact that the game's levels were split into smaller segments, and you almost never had these sprawling open-ended areas with multiple ways of dispatching your target.

[Xenich]

Ultima to a certain point, but I have quite mixed feelings if the pinnacle was reached with IV or VII. In the end I guess I would choose IV because of the idea of mastering all the virtues and becoming Avatar.

Wizardry also got better and I think VII was the high point of the series. I've tried to get into VIII multiple times, but for some reason I've failed every time. The game just doesn't click with me for some reason.

Zelda got better, but after Majora's Mask (which I think is the best in the series) it's been downhill. Though I wouldn't say that Zelda 2 was better than the 1st one, but I take this opportunity to say that I think that Castlevania 2 was better than the 1st one and even with some irritating aspects I think it's still the best game in the series. **** the Angry Video Game Nerd for starting the collective internet hate for that game - don't blame the game if you suck at it, the gameplay mechanic (moving and attacking) is basically the same with the 1st one. I was able to play it through when I was 9 years old without any guides and I was able to do it again after 30 years even though I had forgotten most of it. When it comes to console games it was ahead of it's time, the true foundation of metroidvanias, alongside with Metroid and The Goonies 2, another underappreciated game with some rough edges.

But yeah, even though these series mentioned got better, they weren't able to keep it up after a certain point.

Yeah, it was a bit of a "change" from VII in various things, but I think VIII was a good progression to 3D all things considered. I would think if they had continued on after VIII, the game would have fleshed out and improved from that transition. I think also because I was playing EQ at the time, it just felt right as I had the familiarity of EQ in that style and feel and being that it was Wizardry, it appealed to me. Though the transition to 3D did seem to make or break many peoples love of various series (Might and Magic IX for instance).

I wish studios would release their development tools for older games as they moved on to different things, it would have been a good for keeping interest in their IP, even if they didn't plan on continuing a given title.

[Witchgrove Games]

Ultima to a certain point, but I have quite mixed feelings if the pinnacle was reached with IV or VII. In the end I guess I would choose IV because of the idea of mastering all the virtues and becoming Avatar.

Wizardry also got better and I think VII was the high point of the series. I've tried to get into VIII multiple times, but for some reason I've failed every time. The game just doesn't click with me for some reason.

Zelda got better, but after Majora's Mask (which I think is the best in the series) it's been downhill. Though I wouldn't say that Zelda 2 was better than the 1st one, but I take this opportunity to say that I think that Castlevania 2 was better than the 1st one and even with some irritating aspects I think it's still the best game in the series. **** the Angry Video Game Nerd for starting the collective internet hate for that game - don't blame the game if you suck at it, the gameplay mechanic (moving and attacking) is basically the same with the 1st one. I was able to play it through when I was 9 years old without any guides and I was able to do it again after 30 years even though I had forgotten most of it. When it comes to console games it was ahead of it's time, the true foundation of metroidvanias, alongside with Metroid and The Goonies 2, another underappreciated game with some rough edges.

But yeah, even though these series mentioned got better, they weren't able to keep it up after a certain point.

Yeah, it was a bit of a "change" from VII in various things, but I think VIII was a good progression to 3D all things considered. I would think if they had continued on after VIII, the game would have fleshed out and improved from that transition. I think also because I was playing EQ at the time, it just felt right as I had the familiarity of EQ in that style and feel and being that it was Wizardry, it appealed to me. Though the transition to 3D did seem to make or break many peoples love of various series (Might and Magic IX for instance).

I wish studios would release their development tools for older games as they moved on to different things, it would have been a good for keeping interest in their IP, even if they didn't plan on continuing a given title.

I didn't mind the transition to 3D, but I admit that I would have preferred grid-based movement. I've only tried M&M IX for a brief moment, but I actually thought that M&M X was ok - though the main reason was probably the lack of other proper grid-based dungeon crawlers at the time.

I think Wizardry VIII didn't click me, because I had to play it with a fresh party and each time I started it from the beginning I somehow managed to create quite useless party. Perhaps I would have needed just a little bit more patience and see how things would have turned out eventually. I'm still fantasizing that someday I would play VI-VIII with the same party, but unfortunately at the moment I don't have the time or the energy to start something so time consuming. Perhaps someday.

I agree what you said about studios and dev tools. It's also a shame that there are many great old IPs that just sit on the shelf and gather dust, but then again I really wouldn't want to experience a modern version of Lands of Lore or Ultima published by EA and developed by Bioware. I think EA has already done enough for both series.

[Xenich]

Ultima to a certain point, but I have quite mixed feelings if the pinnacle was reached with IV or VII. In the end I guess I would choose IV because of the idea of mastering all the virtues and becoming Avatar.

Wizardry also got better and I think VII was the high point of the series. I've tried to get into VIII multiple times, but for some reason I've failed every time. The game just doesn't click with me for some reason.

Zelda got better, but after Majora's Mask (which I think is the best in the series) it's been downhill. Though I wouldn't say that Zelda 2 was better than the 1st one, but I take this opportunity to say that I think that Castlevania 2 was better than the 1st one and even with some irritating aspects I think it's still the best game in the series. **** the Angry Video Game Nerd for starting the collective internet hate for that game - don't blame the game if you suck at it, the gameplay mechanic (moving and attacking) is basically the same with the 1st one. I was able to play it through when I was 9 years old without any guides and I was able to do it again after 30 years even though I had forgotten most of it. When it comes to console games it was ahead of it's time, the true foundation of metroidvanias, alongside with Metroid and The Goonies 2, another underappreciated game with some rough edges.

But yeah, even though these series mentioned got better, they weren't able to keep it up after a certain point.

Yeah, it was a bit of a "change" from VII in various things, but I think VIII was a good progression to 3D all things considered. I would think if they had continued on after VIII, the game would have fleshed out and improved from that transition. I think also because I was playing EQ at the time, it just felt right as I had the familiarity of EQ in that style and feel and being that it was Wizardry, it appealed to me. Though the transition to 3D did seem to make or break many peoples love of various series (Might and Magic IX for instance).

I wish studios would release their development tools for older games as they moved on to different things, it would have been a good for keeping interest in their IP, even if they didn't plan on continuing a given title.

I didn't mind the transition to 3D, but I admit that I would have preferred grid-based movement. I've only tried M&M IX for a brief moment, but I actually thought that M&M X was ok - though the main reason was probably the lack of other proper grid-based dungeon crawlers at the time.

I think Wizardry VIII didn't click me, because I had to play it with a fresh party and each time I started it from the beginning I somehow managed to create quite useless party. Perhaps I would have needed just a little bit more patience and see how things would have turned out eventually. I'm still fantasizing that someday I would play VI-VIII with the same party, but unfortunately at the moment I don't have the time or the energy to start something so time consuming. Perhaps someday.

I agree what you said about studios and dev tools. It's also a shame that there are many great old IPs that just sit on the shelf and gather dust, but then again I really wouldn't want to experience a modern version of Lands of Lore or Ultima published by EA and developed by Bioware. I think EA has already done enough for both series.

Well, if you don't have your Wiz VII party to import, that is certainly is an issue, but there are some ways to "cheat" it with some editors to match what your previous Wiz VII party was if that is the biggest hang up.

I stopped "hoping" for a good continuation of various series due to the fact that anything they make these days will be nothing more than a **** party to urinate on the IP, so personally I prefer them to stay dead lest they bury various series for good. The only hope I have is that maybe someday the industry collapses, the woke moves on to something else (or dies out) and the only thing left are "actual" gamers who care about game play and are dedicated to seeing a true representation of the series.

That hope is fleeting though because the problem isn't just the politics destroying the games, but decades of poor game design practices that have corrupted many players out there as to what a game really is and their conditioning that has brought them to view consequence of choice and proper risk vs reward as "bad design".

There is also the issue of how much consoles have influenced game design to which decades of players have become accustomed to and see as acceptable implementations. Due to those things, honestly I doubt we will ever see gaming of that era return due to the drastic differences of opinion on various elements of play.