The Elder Scrolls

[Anon]

I know you're mostly joking

Not in the least. I've probably put more time into MMOs than some of you have been alive. I even learned how to speak Chinese by playing Lineage 2.

Sure but well, MMORPGs have pretty different demographics. OSRS got almost no presence in Asia for example and the bulk of the players are western.

[Anon]

(I'm not allowed to play MMOs anymore because I get addicted)

This hits hard, I'm also trying to play less (though it's basically the best possible past-time (pastime?) for work which makes stopping altogether almost impossible for me)

[gastovski]

TBH I feel for younger players, it's hard to understand what a dev that actually cares about their game is like if you've never experienced it. Check out some of those bigger passion project private servers, your shit will be slapped the moment you try to cheat or RMT. That's what MMOs used to be like.

I'm looking into a LOTRO private server that's soon gonna launch (echoes of angmar if you wanna check), I might even make a topic here if I play it and find it enjoyable.

yeah i wanna play that too in fact i joined the server a while ago but i didnt want to give my phone number for activation

[Anon]

TBH I feel for younger players, it's hard to understand what a dev that actually cares about their game is like if you've never experienced it. Check out some of those bigger passion project private servers, your shit will be slapped the moment you try to cheat or RMT. That's what MMOs used to be like.

I'm looking into a LOTRO private server that's soon gonna launch (echoes of angmar if you wanna check), I might even make a topic here if I play it and find it enjoyable.

yeah i wanna play that too in fact i joined the server a while ago but i didnt want to give my phone number for activation

It's pretty easy to get a fake number for these kinda things

[Tweed]

EQ and UO playercount was pretty minimal in comparison, you can't have a GM comb through 200k accounts lol

Plus GMs holds so much power and are so prone to corruption, employing them always degenerate into corruption scandals and are highly unprofessional.

Bank boxes in UO set off a flag when 1 million gold was placed into the account. I'm sure there were other automated monitoring systems in place in both games to check for abnormal amounts of resources, but when chinkoids are running your game and the bot armies bring in half of your income...

[Anon]

EQ and UO playercount was pretty minimal in comparison, you can't have a GM comb through 200k accounts lol

Plus GMs holds so much power and are so prone to corruption, employing them always degenerate into corruption scandals and are highly unprofessional.

Bank boxes in UO set off a flag when 1 million gold was placed into the account. I'm sure there were other automated monitoring systems in place in both games to check for abnormal amounts of resources, but when chinkoids are running your game and the bot armies bring in half of your income...

Most MMOs have a similar system, but obviously the goldfarmers aren't stupid and devise ways to circumvent that by, for example, transferring smaller chunks of money, or dying in PvP to trade the loot to the PKer etc, so it isn't really this straightforward.

[Tweed]

EQ and UO playercount was pretty minimal in comparison, you can't have a GM comb through 200k accounts lol

Plus GMs holds so much power and are so prone to corruption, employing them always degenerate into corruption scandals and are highly unprofessional.

Bank boxes in UO set off a flag when 1 million gold was placed into the account. I'm sure there were other automated monitoring systems in place in both games to check for abnormal amounts of resources, but when chinkoids are running your game and the bot armies bring in half of your income...

Most MMOs have a similar system, but obviously the goldfarmers aren't stupid and devise ways to circumvent that by, for example, transferring smaller chunks of money, or dying in PvP to trade the loot to the PKer etc, so it isn't really this straightforward.

It's not that hard to put systems in place to stop this sort of thing, if they wanted to stop the goldfarmers and botters they could do so easily.

[Anon]

Bank boxes in UO set off a flag when 1 million gold was placed into the account. I'm sure there were other automated monitoring systems in place in both games to check for abnormal amounts of resources, but when chinkoids are running your game and the bot armies bring in half of your income...

Most MMOs have a similar system, but obviously the goldfarmers aren't stupid and devise ways to circumvent that by, for example, transferring smaller chunks of money, or dying in PvP to trade the loot to the PKer etc, so it isn't really this straightforward.

It's not that hard to put systems in place to stop this sort of thing, if they wanted to stop the goldfarmers and botters they could do so easily.

The issue is also that if you start being too hardlined you'll also start banning a lot of legitimate players who'd trade huge amounts of gold for various reasons. Then you'd need to comb through each appeal, but when you get thousands of daily requests because your automated system is too rigid, you got an even bigger problem than just letting bots roam around.

Your fundamental point is right though, definitely the companies want bots around because they bring revenue themselves plus bring the impression of the game being fuller than it really is.

[TKVNC]

The issue is also that if you start being too hardlined you'll also start banning a lot of legitimate players who'd trade huge amounts of gold for various reasons. Then you'd need to comb through each appeal, but when you get thousands of daily requests because your automated system is too rigid, you got an even bigger problem than just letting bots roam around.

It's ultimately why automated systems don't work. There is (currently) no replacement for direct human moderation by non-pozzed individuals.

[Anon]

The issue is also that if you start being too hardlined you'll also start banning a lot of legitimate players who'd trade huge amounts of gold for various reasons. Then you'd need to comb through each appeal, but when you get thousands of daily requests because your automated system is too rigid, you got an even bigger problem than just letting bots roam around.

It's ultimately why automated systems don't work. There is (currently) no replacement for direct human moderation by non-pozzed individuals.

Yeah but then we got to the other problem that it isn't feasible to comb through tens, hundreds of thousands of daily requests, plus permanent risk of corruption from human moderators, which would also be a bigger problem than bots themselves.

[TKVNC]

The issue is also that if you start being too hardlined you'll also start banning a lot of legitimate players who'd trade huge amounts of gold for various reasons. Then you'd need to comb through each appeal, but when you get thousands of daily requests because your automated system is too rigid, you got an even bigger problem than just letting bots roam around.

It's ultimately why automated systems don't work. There is (currently) no replacement for direct human moderation by non-pozzed individuals.

Yeah but then we got to the other problem that it isn't feasible to comb through tens, hundreds of thousands of daily requests, plus permanent risk of corruption from human moderators, which would also be a bigger problem than bots themselves.

Then the objectively best system is full drop of items when you die, and zero moderation. Let the people govern themselves.

[Anon]

There are some MMOs like that like Mortal Online which are pretty shit

But yeah in conclusion that's the biggest challenge of tackling the botting problem: solutions people try devise will lead to unintended consequences that end up being worse than the bots themselves.

[Oyster Sauce]

You only need to permaban a few players before others start wondering if they should risk their account they've put thousands of hours into. For reference, the harshest ban in WoW Classic for gold buying was 7 days and you were allowed to keep everything you bought with the gold, and this was being struck by lightning rare.

[TKVNC]

There are some MMOs like that like Mortal Online which are pretty shit

But yeah in conclusion that's the biggest challenge of tackling the botting problem: solutions people try devise will lead to unintended consequences that end up being worse than the bots themselves.

It's a shit system. But the reality is, only shaming RWT/RMT Whales will ever stop them. When I used to play WoW, if there was evidence of Whales, I'd never invite them to raids, and actively grief them if I could.

[Anon]

You only need to permaban a few players before others start wondering if they should risk their account they've put thousands of hours into. For reference, the harshest ban in WoW Classic for gold buying was 7 days and you were allowed to keep everything you bought with the gold, and this was being struck by lightning rare.

The issue with this is that you're presupposing people think rationally but they don't. I've seen plenty people get permabanned from MMOs and gold buying/botting is still a thing (even from people who get banned and make a new account) because people are stupid, addicted and think it won't happen with him.

There are some MMOs like that like Mortal Online which are pretty shit

But yeah in conclusion that's the biggest challenge of tackling the botting problem: solutions people try devise will lead to unintended consequences that end up being worse than the bots themselves.

It's a shit system. But the reality is, only shaming RWT/RMT Whales will ever stop them. When I used to play WoW, if there was evidence of Whales, I'd never invite them to raids, and actively grief them if I could.

I wish this was a feasible solution

[Kalarion]

Then the objectively best system is full drop of items when you die, and zero moderation. Let the people govern themselves.

Disagree

The people will not govern themselves. They will rather become totally enslaved (in Minecraft) to any well-organized bot gangs.

[gastovski]

Did you know that in final high isle dlc there is a tranny looking repulsive tree character within main story called "they/them"?

Now, last year with Necrom dlc they have made up a silly "female" daedra which Herma Mora writes her off from existence

This is her now, doesn't even look like an elder scrolls character at all looks like out of place, obviously diversity agenda here

[Vergil]

ESO lore is pure slop. MMOs poison the lore for any franchise they touch.

[maidenhaver]

TES lore ends with Morrowind.

[rusty_shackleford]

TES lore ends with Daggerfall, we don't recognize breton retcons in this household.

[gastovski]

False, it will never end with Microsoft

[maidenhaver]

Bretons weren't retconned. They're still nedics.