Werewolf: the Apocalypse

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Bah! They don't even play at physical tabletops anymore.
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Ratcatcher
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Werewolf: the Apocalypse

Post by Ratcatcher »

I recently discovered this juicy piece of info, I thought I was one of the few remaining conoisseurs:

Image

So, @rusty_shackleford, when are we hunting down some disgusting fomori and Black Spiral Dancers?

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Luckmann
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Post by Luckmann »

Having recently dug into the idea of running a V20 game, I've naturally gotten into a ton of garou stuff too, I must say that I've never really understood the appeal of Wereyiff: The Apocalypse. It's got some cool ideas and I like the whole eco-fash potential, anti-corpo action, Pentex is a funny 80's-90's-style anti-environment villain, but then I feel like the whole thing just shits the bed and snows itself in on the whole homid/lupus thing and a bunch of breeding bullshit that only seems to be there to satisfy someone's fetish, and I also don't find any of the tribes that interesting or distinctive. It doesn't help that the materials for the other changing breeds are few and far between, and that they are supposed to be even rarer than garou.

I can't help but to think that it would've been better to scrap the whole yiff thing and have different changing breeds entirely, instead of just garou and their tribes.
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Post by Ratcatcher »

Sry, didn't notice you had answered this @Luckmann
Luckmann wrote: February 6th, 2023, 15:53
but then I feel like the whole thing just shits the bed and snows itself in on the whole homid/lupus thing and a bunch of breeding bullshit that only seems to be there to satisfy someone's fetish
Meh. you're talking early '90 stuff man. I was there playing this shit, we had no idea what a furry was or that some people could find such things sexually arousing. If it can be considered a proof, no one amongst the 20 or so people I used to play mixed OWoD games became perverts of any kind. Most of those went on to become fathers and family men. It was mainly a power fantasy for us. It's an RPG in which the weakest character you can make (STR 1) jumps to 5 (max for most other supernaturals) by simply deciding to get angry. Throwing cars around and opening holes in concrete walls never gets old, believe me.

As for why Lupus vs Homid exists, mainly to cause intestine fights without having to always resort to tribes fighting. Its main use is a tool for the Storyteller. Consider WhiteWolf games were rife with personal nemesis, plotting behind the scene and so on. Anything that can cause division is usable, in that context.

As far as the game beckground goes tho, there's a basis which arches back to the Impergium, the ancient conflict that saw the shapeshifters (mainly garous) attack the world of mortal men and each other. Once, only truebreed (Metis) were a thing. But Gaia cursed them and from then on the sons and daughters of a couple of true shapeshifters, is always born with some sort of defect. That's why they are now forced to choose if they want to be Man-wolves or Wolf-men. Metises also have the better gifts of the 3, marginally.
Luckmann wrote: February 6th, 2023, 15:53
and I also don't find any of the tribes that interesting or distinctive.
Those are mainly for RP purposes. And I never found anyone having issues with those. Consider they are structured as "Couples" so you have 2 urban dwelling clans (Glass Walker and Bone Gnawers), 2 injun clans (Wendigo and Uktena) 2 "Royal" clans (Silver Fang and Shadowlors). Most of those overlap to avoid having a single tribe dominating a niche completely.
Vampires aren't structured much differently, although they are definitely more varied.
Luckmann wrote: February 6th, 2023, 15:53
It doesn't help that the materials for the other changing breeds are few and far between, and that they are supposed to be even rarer than garou.
Mmh. There's a splatbook for each other main changing breed. You may also want to have a look at Hengeyokai (shapeshifters of the east) for a bunch of new shapeshifters.
Yes, they are supposed to be very rare. Again, there are very good lore reasons for that but I feel I'd take too long to properly explain and it's something that ultimately went nowhere, as WhiteWolf had a very profound change of heart and management in the first decade of the 2k. They shat all over their established lore, at least for the WoD at large that is.


As far as where is the appeal, on top of the aforementioned power fantasy, you get to play a game with heavy politics but without the darkest connotation of the other supernaturals. Werewolves are the good guys, in the setting, or at least they are the most decent.
There's also the topic of the enemies they face. You named Pentex already which is a great and easily usable villain, even for Storytellers with little experience. Fomori are varied, twisted and always interesting from both the ST and player perspective, you are encouraged to build your own and throw immense variety by the setting itself. Black Spiral Dancers are another great overarching enemy, extremely well writen. Some of the best material in Werewolf is relative to BSD.

Umbra can easily be used as a tool to prepare LoK: Souls Reaver-like scenarios or as a place to have completely different adventures. When compared to all other supernaturals in OWoD, Garous are the ones you can more easily have visit varied locations. Start with suburbia, go deep into a metropolis or towards the wild and finally have them confront some major spiritual threat. That's a campaign there already. I sincerely don't know how much experience you have with GMing in general but I personally value that. A GM with tools at his disposals makes his players happy.
Luckmann wrote: February 6th, 2023, 15:53
I can't help but to think that it would've been better to scrap the whole yiff thing and have different changing breeds entirely, instead of just garou and their tribes.
Well, as I said, you can pretty much play with other changing breeds already. I alway bitch about how furry degenerates gave a bad name to one of my fav settings. If you were to ask me what I find more gay tho, when comparing a Garou to this, I'd say the second is at least 28,5% more gay.
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