Tipping Culture - Discussion and Entitled Zoomie Memes

[Metalhead33]

*tips fedora*

[Nemesis]

But their job is to render that service. It's literally the point.
You shouldn't have to pay extra to have the job done well.
...
Clearly there is something wrong with the current pay structure for such jobs in America.

The minimum wage for waiters and bartenders is so low they must rely on tips to live. Thus, they are incentivized to provide good service so they can get a decent tip. In theory, they won't get anything if the service is bad, but, in practice, they'll get 5%, maybe 10% as a "fuck you."

The issue nowadays lies in the waiters who assume they'll get a good tip regardless of service.

[Irenaeus]

The issue nowadays lies in the waiters who assume they'll get a good tip regardless of service.

Just have them serve niggers

[Anon]

But their job is to render that service. It's literally the point.
You shouldn't have to pay extra to have the job done well.
...
Clearly there is something wrong with the current pay structure for such jobs in America.

Thus, they are incentivized to provide good service so they can get a decent tip.

This mindset also brings another significant problem though: I often see bartenders clearly providing better treatment for people who pay a lot (so you can expect significantly higher tips from them) while treating people who pay less like shit.

Regarding ethnicity, sex etc. I tip great services regardless of individual profile, I don't judge people at an individual level.

[Xenich]

But their job is to render that service. It's literally the point.
You shouldn't have to pay extra to have the job done well.
...
Clearly there is something wrong with the current pay structure for such jobs in America.

Thus, they are incentivized to provide good service so they can get a decent tip.

This mindset also brings another significant problem though: I often see bartenders clearly providing better treatment for people who pay a lot (so you can expect significantly higher tips from them) while treating people who pay less like shit.

Regarding ethnicity, sex etc. I tip great services regardless of individual profile, I don't judge people at an individual level.

I have dealt with those types and when I see it, I don't tip them at all. They are only hurting themselves when they act like whores and I have seen some actually get less tips from higher patrons because of it.

Also, you never know a person simply by how they spend either. Seen guys worth millions always pick over the prices at a restaurant, ask for the specials and prices, etc... and tip accordingly, but then on a special holiday, drop a tip that would make gold diggers thighs shudder. Seen a couple of service snobs lose out on a tip that was larger than their annual tip take in for it.

[Nooneatall]

The whole system has fucked up incentives just like sales. It's the assumption that you can make lazy people work hard if they are also stupid and greedy. This is retard thinking. Waiters should be paid less but not below minimum wage and business owners shouldn't be allowed to subsidize their wages like this. It's like how walmart pays really badly and then the government subsidizes them by giving their workers section 8 housing and food stamps.

[Metalhead33]

I ain't tipping your ass. Ask your boss to pay better.

[Xenich]

The whole system has fucked up incentives just like sales. It's the assumption that you can make lazy people work hard if they are also stupid and greedy. This is retard thinking. Waiters should be paid less but not below minimum wage and business owners shouldn't be allowed to subsidize their wages like this. It's like how walmart pays really badly and then the government subsidizes them by giving their workers section 8 housing and food stamps.

Well, there used to be a time when these types of service jobs were paid normal wages and tips were just a perk to the job. Government got involved and so businesses adjusted because of it.

A lot of people think it is the business trying to screw the employee (and some may be), but a lot of it is the government forcing the business to find a solution that doesn't bankrupt them (small to medium, big businesses make all the rules and buy all the politicians).

For instance, lets say you pay an employee $10 an hour. Now, you have to pay workman's comp, which in some states is around 80% + of the wage. So now you are at $18 an hour. Then add in any other mandatory healthcare, etc... and you could be as high as 25 bucks an hour to pay what the employee is only making $10 an hour for. This is how illegals are screwing our system and why a lot of them are hired under the table for.

It is a real problem in areas like farming and construction and why a lot of illegals are working "businesses" that are illegal and pushing out all of the legal ones. With some contractors, is just isn't in the cards to hire legally if you want to stay competitive with the illegals. They don't pay taxes, licenses, or any of the state/fed required costs to hire a person. On top of that, they also don't have inspectors, building licenses, fees, etc...

I have seen legal contractors get the book thrown at them over some stupid mistake, while illegal ones get let go because of you know... don't want to seem racist!

Point is, all of this is government implemented and it is the problem. If government influence was removed from the equation, you would have a lot better paying jobs, better competition, and better quality of result.

Yet you can't explain this to the commie idiot faggots who promote all this government involvement. They are literally cutting their own throats with the polices they support.

[Statesman]

The minimum wage for waiters and bartenders is so low they must rely on tips to live. Thus, they are incentivized to provide good service so they can get a decent tip. In theory, they won't get anything, but, in practice, they'll get 5%, maybe 10% just as a "fuck you."

I mean, employers have to cover their wages (either up to the minimum, or anything above if stipulated in their contract), even if "tips" aren't enough to cover whatever agreement they used to embezzle the waiters. But since employees have so few rights in the US, it is easier to fire them and have them sue you than to do the right thing (ie tips as an incentivation bonus) like most of the world does.

[Anon]

The whole system has fucked up incentives just like sales. It's the assumption that you can make lazy people work hard if they are also stupid and greedy. This is retard thinking. Waiters should be paid less but not below minimum wage and business owners shouldn't be allowed to subsidize their wages like this. It's like how walmart pays really badly and then the government subsidizes them by giving their workers section 8 housing and food stamps.

Well, there used to be a time when these types of service jobs were paid normal wages and tips were just a perk to the job. Government got involved and so businesses adjusted because of it.

A lot of people think it is the business trying to screw the employee (and some may be), but a lot of it is the government forcing the business to find a solution that doesn't bankrupt them (small to medium, big businesses make all the rules and buy all the politicians).

For instance, lets say you pay an employee $10 an hour. Now, you have to pay workman's comp, which in some states is around 80% + of the wage. So now you are at $18 an hour. Then add in any other mandatory healthcare, etc... and you could be as high as 25 bucks an hour to pay what the employee is only making $10 an hour for. This is how illegals are screwing our system and why a lot of them are hired under the table for.

It is a real problem in areas like farming and construction and why a lot of illegals are working "businesses" that are illegal and pushing out all of the legal ones. With some contractors, is just isn't in the cards to hire legally if you want to stay competitive with the illegals. They don't pay taxes, licenses, or any of the state/fed required costs to hire a person. On top of that, they also don't have inspectors, building licenses, fees, etc...

I have seen legal contractors get the book thrown at them over some stupid mistake, while illegal ones get let go because of you know... don't want to seem racist!

Point is, all of this is government implemented and it is the problem. If government influence was removed from the equation, you would have a lot better paying jobs, better competition, and better quality of result.

Yet you can't explain this to the commie idiot faggots who promote all this government involvement. They are literally cutting their own throats with the polices they support.

Whenever I see government getting involved it's to either demand the businesses pay at least minimum wages or demand they stop stealing workers' tips (lots of businesses demand their bartenders hand over part of the tips they receive)

[Kalarion]

If your income depends on tips you're fucking retarded and need to be removed from the gene pool. Sorry.

You can downvote me all you want, @Kalarion. I'm right tho.

Too pat. There's more to it than, "gas the tippies, wage wars now".

Tipping culture in America is complicated, but it basically boils down to: the restaurant industry as it exists wouldn't survive without tipping wages.

If tips as a replacement for wages went away, the entire mid-level restaurant industry would crash, hard. All that would be left is fast food and high-end dining for the truly wealthy (or the truly retarded, who don't pay attention to where their money is going). So pressure comes from both directions: consumers, who want to go to Chili's etc and have a tasty meal 3-4 times a week; and owners, who would instantly lose everything if any slightest change tipped everything over. Tip workers get the shit end as a result.

I think the solution is that families learn to cook their own food again, and restaurants become a rare treat to celebrate a big occasion for the middle and working class.

[asf]

How would restaurants collapse without tips, can't they survive like any other restaurant in the world

[Hauberk]

Regarding ethnicity, sex etc. I tip great services regardless of individual profile, I don't judge people at an individual level.

How would you react to getting a dangerhair or tranny waiter? I don't think I could stomach the diversity myself, to be honest.

[Anon]

Regarding ethnicity, sex etc. I tip great services regardless of individual profile, I don't judge people at an individual level.

How would you react to getting a dangerhair or tranny waiter? I don't think I could stomach the diversity myself, to be honest.

Maintaining a kempt appearance is basic part of providing a good bartender service.

Yeah I probably wouldn't tip a tranny, unless it proved itself to provide a superb service despite that condition and succeeded in making me forget my natural displeasantry of being near one

[Rand]

Tipping culture in America is complicated, but it basically boils down to: the restaurant industry as it exists wouldn't survive without tipping wages.

Yet somehow the rest of the world makes it work.
Something is wrong with the system that is incentivizing the wrong things to get this uniquely bad outcome in America.

[Kalarion]

How would restaurants collapse without tips, can't they survive like any other restaurant in the world

Their entire business model revolves around one thing: charging something like 3000% of the cost to obtain luxury drinks (mostly soda, but also alcohol).

The food side produces almost no profit. It doesn't even cover operation costs. The overall cost of a meal (including the cost to pay your waiting staff to take and deliver that meal) is kept as low as possible. Its sole purpose is bringing in as many customers as possible, to then have them drink as much as possible.

If mid-level restaurants (chains and mom-and-pops) suddenly had to pay even minimum wage to their workers, the only place they could get that money is by raising the price of a meal. Once prices go up, the flow of customers slows down or stops completely. Mid-level restaurants live the equivalent of paycheck to paycheck, the vast majority (I would be willing to bet on it being 99%+) don't retain earnings and couldn't continue operations for more than a month if the customer flow even took a significant dip, let alone stopped for any significant length of time.

We saw a preview of that here in America during the coof lockdowns, where the restaurant industry lost its collective minds. If such a halt was sustained and unsubsidized, the entire industry would just vanish. There's no way to make it sustainable without either doing what we're doing now, or heavily socializing the entire society ala Europe.

[Xenich]

The whole system has fucked up incentives just like sales. It's the assumption that you can make lazy people work hard if they are also stupid and greedy. This is retard thinking. Waiters should be paid less but not below minimum wage and business owners shouldn't be allowed to subsidize their wages like this. It's like how walmart pays really badly and then the government subsidizes them by giving their workers section 8 housing and food stamps.

Well, there used to be a time when these types of service jobs were paid normal wages and tips were just a perk to the job. Government got involved and so businesses adjusted because of it.

A lot of people think it is the business trying to screw the employee (and some may be), but a lot of it is the government forcing the business to find a solution that doesn't bankrupt them (small to medium, big businesses make all the rules and buy all the politicians).

For instance, lets say you pay an employee $10 an hour. Now, you have to pay workman's comp, which in some states is around 80% + of the wage. So now you are at $18 an hour. Then add in any other mandatory healthcare, etc... and you could be as high as 25 bucks an hour to pay what the employee is only making $10 an hour for. This is how illegals are screwing our system and why a lot of them are hired under the table for.

It is a real problem in areas like farming and construction and why a lot of illegals are working "businesses" that are illegal and pushing out all of the legal ones. With some contractors, is just isn't in the cards to hire legally if you want to stay competitive with the illegals. They don't pay taxes, licenses, or any of the state/fed required costs to hire a person. On top of that, they also don't have inspectors, building licenses, fees, etc...

I have seen legal contractors get the book thrown at them over some stupid mistake, while illegal ones get let go because of you know... don't want to seem racist!

Point is, all of this is government implemented and it is the problem. If government influence was removed from the equation, you would have a lot better paying jobs, better competition, and better quality of result.

Yet you can't explain this to the commie idiot faggots who promote all this government involvement. They are literally cutting their own throats with the polices they support.

Whenever I see government getting involved it's to either demand the businesses pay at least minimum wages or demand they stop stealing workers' tips (lots of businesses demand their bartenders hand over part of the tips they receive)

Likely because the employer is using "tip credit" to use it to report it as a part of the employees wage.

The government is involved outside of that as well. All the laws to run a business, pay employees, etc.. have tons of things the business has to pay just to "legally" hire them and that ranges from the city laws, country, and the fed. All of them stick their hand in.

The reality is, if we had no minimum wage laws, no government mandating various things a business has to do in such cases, people would be payed better ultimately (this also removes big business being able to get laws implemented that kills off small business competition). Problem is, in order to work and operate in a society like that, you have to be:

1) Responsible for yourself, decide for yourself and realize the consequences of those decisions.

2) Not be a complete moron.

3) Government would have to be completely stripped of a lot of its current power that it has over the system.

Things that are basically non-existent in todays society.

Like I said with my example a few posts ago, about how the worker hated where they worked, but was unwilling to go somewhere else. They just took it, and kept bitching about it rather than "taking responsibility" for their choice.

I have worked many jobs where I negotiated my wage and it was far above the people who had been working there for years because I actually was willing to walk away and they needed my skills. If I worked a job that I hated, I looked for another, or developed skills to open my options. Most people won't do this, they will just sit and complain about their lot in life (many are afraid of change, or dread learning new things).

It isn't a "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" type of thing, it is just common sense, but too many people are unwilling to deal with the consequences that come with making a major decision like that (you may have to take lower pay a bit to transition into a new skill/field, or being able to say no to a job you really want because the pay/conditions really aren't worth it).

So, the result is everyone whines to the government, it swoops in and mandates the business and the employee thinks they are happy, well.. until the cycle of the minimum wage increase works its way through the system, businesses adjust prices, the market adjusts (while using this as a means to gain a little extra as well) and the person demanding the increase is actually worse off than before the increase.

What is funny is that the bulk of business in for instance the US, are small to medium businesses and yet... they are never the ones that are on board with minimum wage increases. Yet the large businesses are so noble they often will virtual signal a raise when it is hot in the media. Why? Because they can eat the increase and manage it, small to medium businesses operate at a very narrow margin and can not. This means the small businesses get put out of business and big business wins the day.

Who owns all the major corps? Who runs the country? Yep...

[Nemesis]

I often see bartenders clearly providing better treatment for people who pay a lot (so you can expect significantly higher tips from them) while treating people who pay less like shit.

Bartenders are in the business of selling as much alcohol as possible per night. When they spot a whale -- a guy consistently buying expensive drinks; ideally a lot of them, e.g. shots with top-shelf liquor -- of course they'll give him more attention compared to the lonely guy buying a beer.

What I've done to get in the "good graces" of bartenders is throwing them a buck (if I ordered a beer) or two (if they made a cocktail) on the first two visits. That way, when I return, they'll be quick to serve me because they'll anticipate a small tip, which might not happen on each visit. This worked in most scenarios, and I'm rarely ignored. If I'm with a woman or a few women, I have them order the drinks because, in most cases, bartenders are men, and they'll always serve the girls first, regardless of the line.

[Nooneatall]

How would restaurants collapse without tips, can't they survive like any other restaurant in the world

Their entire business model revolves around one thing: charging something like 3000% of the cost to obtain luxury drinks (mostly soda, but also alcohol).

The food side produces almost no profit. It doesn't even cover operation costs. The overall cost of a meal (including the cost to pay your waiting staff to take and deliver that meal) is kept as low as possible. Its sole purpose is bringing in as many customers as possible, to then have them drink as much as possible.

If mid-level restaurants (chains and mom-and-pops) suddenly had to pay even minimum wage to their workers, the only place they could get that money is by raising the price of a meal. Once prices go up, the flow of customers slows down or stops completely. Mid-level restaurants live the equivalent of paycheck to paycheck, the vast majority (I would be willing to bet on it being 99%+) don't retain earnings and couldn't continue operations for more than a month if the customer flow even took a significant dip, let alone stopped for any significant length of time.

We saw a preview of that here in America during the coof lockdowns, where the restaurant industry lost its collective minds. If such a halt was sustained and unsubsidized, the entire industry would just vanish. There's no way to make it sustainable without either doing what we're doing now, or heavily socializing the entire society ala Europe.

I can't wait for total restaurant collapse and then total societal collapse.

[Xenich]

How would restaurants collapse without tips, can't they survive like any other restaurant in the world

Their entire business model revolves around one thing: charging something like 3000% of the cost to obtain luxury drinks (mostly soda, but also alcohol).

The food side produces almost no profit. It doesn't even cover operation costs. The overall cost of a meal (including the cost to pay your waiting staff to take and deliver that meal) is kept as low as possible. Its sole purpose is bringing in as many customers as possible, to then have them drink as much as possible.

If mid-level restaurants (chains and mom-and-pops) suddenly had to pay even minimum wage to their workers, the only place they could get that money is by raising the price of a meal. Once prices go up, the flow of customers slows down or stops completely. Mid-level restaurants live the equivalent of paycheck to paycheck, the vast majority (I would be willing to bet on it being 99%+) don't retain earnings and couldn't continue operations for more than a month if the customer flow even took a significant dip, let alone stopped for any significant length of time.

We saw a preview of that here in America during the coof lockdowns, where the restaurant industry lost its collective minds. If such a halt was sustained and unsubsidized, the entire industry would just vanish. There's no way to make it sustainable without either doing what we're doing now, or heavily socializing the entire society ala Europe.

I can't wait for total restaurant collapse and then total societal collapse.

Won't be total. Will just be all of the small/medium businesses put out. During Covid, all the fast food chains saw MASSIVE profits due to being "allowed" to stay open, kind of like them closing down small general stores, but keeping open Lowes and Home Depot. Since the corps own pretty much all of the big stores, they could close down some chains, while gaining massive profits on others.

So when a "total collapse" happens, it will just be all small and medium businesses and those not owned by the Mega-Corps. Once that is all that is left, expect the real tyranny to begin as they will then start putting in massive "conditions" for you to do business with them.

"Want to buy food? Sure, get this chip installed that tracks you 24/7 and has all your banking information on it with the only mega bank available. Oh, and buy what we want, say what we want, do what we want... or no you can't shop with us, cuz we are a private business and have rights!"

It will be much worse than a collapse. At least with a collapse, there could be a chance for a rebuild. There will be none of that because they will control what is allowed and society will be a "Build back better" slogan, for a certain select group to control everything, completely and with that type of leverage, they will be able to murder people outright in the streets and people won't say shit because they will be too afraid to not be able to get their food, work, etc...

[Shillitron]

Don't forget to leave a tip for excellent service rendered https://rpghq.org/donate

[madbringer]

I only tip barbers, delivery drivers, valets, and bartenders and waiters, both of which depend on service rendered.

That's five services and two people. It's your gf n her friend isnt it?